I mean
i think it should seems like an obviously stupid position to anyone seeking a censorship resistant value transfer system 

but bro isnt playing with a full desk 

 "we shouldn't have privacy because people will do bad things"
isnt that the position of the WEF? 🤔 

 we can at least try for intellectual consistency 

"i like Bitcoin but not censorship resistance" is an untenable position. 

 nah bro

that just becomes "all viewpoints are equally valid"
and our brains leak out our ears and we never actually take a stand anywhere  

 I want to see bitcoiners and moneristas stop measuring value in US dollars.

"Bitcoin was created for fiat NGU"
is fiat thinking  

 as another old guy
gotta say

obsessing over the USD denominated "buying power"
is bullshit fiat thinking 

but some people would rather be rich than free i guess. 

 this.

the only property you can be said to really own,
is the one nobody knows about. 

 lol that's hilarious 

They could just say "fuck you"
but I guess that doesn't dress it up in intellectualism 

 you dont know what Keynesian economics is
admit it 

 this is a nice story.

its a fiat story
but its nice that nice people can live well. 

 If you're 30yrs old and dont have a regular meditation practice 
you're behind the curve 

 😘 

 again
i suggest intellectual honesty over pedantic puritanical zealotry.
thats how bitcoin got this far

not by your stupid maxi bullshit. 

 thats a nice belief 
and i hope it is correct.

I am concerned that a transparent chain which courts institutional investors is begging for regulatory capture and will fail as a result.

beliefs aren't facts and nothing is inevitable. 

 intellectual honestly is fun man

i recommend it 

 totally obsessed with fiat equiv value ain't ya 🤣
its a sad state of affairs in bitcoin these days.

chatter on all day about how worthless fiat is,
then whip out fiat charts...

and Satoshi wept 😬 

 it is truly insidious.
they honestly can simultaneously believe fiat is worthless 
and that fiat denominated prices are good signal

when it suits their narrative anyway.

my belief is that its half greed
and half validation of their worldview. 

 something something trojan horse  

 🤣
nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzp7v96vy3jlyqtct3n3e3sk6hflp7usra0sdkz477axwx4n39nxamqyfhwumn8ghj7am0wsh82arcduhx7mn99uq36amnwvaz7tmwdaehgu3wvf5hgcm0d9hx2u3wwdhkx6tpdshsqg95am3g43jke7ww5hyh027jeaederr8k2s8sfvtg6p2t3c8cpkls5wrhhr4 

 you know

when you're not a maxi zealot retard
you can acknowledge the tradeoffs other chains make

and make intelligent decisions.

you have to give up being a self righteous asshole though,
i suggest you try it. 

 sorry bro
i know the truth hurts

"i dont actually care about privacy, i just want fiat gainz"
another "bitcoiner" 

 the fact that monero has like 10000x the usage aside,

liquid hides tx amounts

monero hides tx amount
and senders inputs
and destination address

so yeah
you would think monero is much better vis a vis privacy  

  ELI5 how incentivizing institutional adoption results in "infecting the system and making it eat itself from the inside out"
(whatever that means)

and NOT regulatory capture of the network and de facto criminalization of sovereign usage. 

 lol
are you serious bro?!

liquid is a fucking ghost town 

 monero has privacy ✅
and decentralization ✅
and a modicum of scalability ✅

🤨 

 Andreas was talking about this sort of thing years ago
it seems unlikely to be valuable to create a walled garden within the network

but regulatory capture is a real thing 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSv0J4bfBCc 

 "and banks just shrug their shoulders and dwindle into insignificance"

as if the people who run the world are just going to go away peacefully 🙄

you didn't answer my question in the slightest. 

 super smart dude 

 RingCT to at least hide amounts?

its seriously battle tested and weird that any bitcoiner would consider it too radical.
everyone is already trusting cryptographic primitives more edgy anyway... 

 sorry not RingCT
just Confidential Transactions 

Liquid has them implementated (as does Monero) so theyre a good source

https://blog.liquid.net/guide-to-confidential-transactions/ 

 theyre gonna get that bullshit where the car bitches at you if you're speeding too 

 tbh I kinda loathe bull markets 

 and privacy preserving!  

 If you have a VPN why do you use tor with Amethyst? 

 PF tek ftw 

do you mail spore syringes? 

 Absolutely

I'm interested in all kinds of spores.
Had a hood setup in my spare room for a while and was doing potato agar cultures.
But got busy and put it all in storage.

Love working with mycelium though... ♥️  

 for the love of God why? 

 arguably one of the worst movies ever made

but maybe fun for that reason 

 bro I don't even know what my follower count is 

 Just go back to muting me dude .

you can't hang. 

 Nothing I'm saying is complicated or controversial

You just don't want to hear it 

 Show me where I said Bitcoin is worse than Monero 

ill wait. 

 goddamn it!

I'm a lying hypocrite and I apologize 😂 

 Goddamn it

I'm a dirty hypocrite and I apologize 🤣 

 hopium.

Bitcoin is gaining buying power because fiat cantillionaires are speculating on it

You don't understand that the underlying unit of account is completely fucked and that accurate pricing is impossible in that scenario That's why housing bubble 
That's why Bitcoin is bubbling 

Only a moron would confuse that with actual accrual of value

Monero doesn't attract the same fiat speculation.
Which isn't a problem if you're interested in actual censorship resistant transactions and not Fiat denominated "wealth" 

 Another Fiat chart
how surprising 🙄

So more US dollars are chasing bitcoin faster than are chasing houses

I'm sure you're very happy that cantillionaires have decided that Bitcoin is more valuable than a house
more fiat for you!

wow 
big deal /s 

 You are understandably anxious to be done with this conversation 👋 

 I think the point of the OP is just that they are promising liberatarian solutions but will end up being as bad or worse than the current statists.

They're not going to "end the fed" Period.
Pretty sure its not even been mentioned...?

But the vibe is that there's a new band of thugs who are jockeying for position to replace the current group of grifters.
They're going to come up with their own method and pretexts for exerting their control.
I don't think there needs to be any current connection to Trumps talking points.
Or any actual connection to reality at all. 

 "I'm not obsessed with fiat"

the entire post is about fiat inflation and how Bitcoin does relative to fiat 🙄  

 imagine believing that fiat USD denomination is "value"

that's what makes you a fiat maxi, although you don't even know you are. 

 All of that is only true when prices are denominated in U.S dollars.

Under a Fiat UOA, prices are not Equal to "value" Because the underlying measurement unit is garbage

All you're really saying is that the money that's being printed is flowing into Bitcoin At a higher proportion than it's flowing into Monero

 Why should I give a fuck about a rigged unit of account system?

The retarded thing is to play their game as if it matters
And that's you bro 

 really weird how you go on and on about inflation and arbitrary money printing 

but then act as if USD prices are actually a measurement of value

and the price of exactly nothing is denominated in gold
so you have no idea if the value of gold is constant or not
thats a statement of faith, not fact.

all prices are denominated in USD these days
The prices of commodities are indicators of how many dollars are chasing those commodities 
iow speculative interest 

 Yeah I;m sure lots of Bitcoiners do this.

But my point is that,
if you divide a fiat price
by the fiat price of bitcoin (or monero)
you DONT arrive at hard money
or a different UoA

you're just comparing the fiat prices of two different things. 

 that isn't what unit of account means.

changing a fiat price into Monero isnt changing that.
UoA is *what prices are denominated in*

that doesnt change until people are pricing things in Monero
without regard for equiv USD ”value" 

 which is why say that USD is the unit of account 

we can personally convert it to whatever if we want
it just doesn't change the UoA 

 Yes totally 
I think that's how it happens
once small communities become more self-reliant and they don't have to interface with the Fiat world 

 Homeboy likes to argue that gold is a good stable store of value
but Monero is bad and inflationary 

its a religious argument 
not a rational one. 

 "the value of gold is constant"

- some dude without any intellectual consistency 

nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzp30pwducmtffm54cqc4cxyyhftks5uhrv30eukxjz2dud273tk9lqyfhwumn8ghj7am0wsh82arcduhx7mn99uq36amnwvaz7tmwdaehgu3wvf5hgcm0d9hx2u3wwdhkx6tpdshsqgyk9mjj3zmymmy8fdw5fehv4wr2c8d623xpu86kxxh29a04lpm6pq4zr7m5 

 go back to your echo chamber 

you're too fragile for the real world 

 I don't know bro 
considering how easy it was to take you to school here
I'd work overtime 

 like gold became worthless and was never adopted as money because of supply inflation ?

oh wait 

 hey
it wasnt me who said gold was a stable store of value for thousands of years.
that was you bro 
 

 lol
that isnt what you said

which of us is being semantic?

also lol
"BUt aSteRoId mIniNG" 

 Realizing that I screwed up this explanation

The Eve-> Alice -> Eve attack I describe is always possible and has nothing to do with a malicious node>
That is to say
if the person you receive the Monero from and the person you send it to are colluding
they can eliminate the decoys in the ring signatures and see the true outputs

The danger with a malicious node is just that if you connect to broadcast a tx without hiding your IP somehow they can see that IP sent that transaction.
Which is usually true with other chains anyway
but Monero uses dandelion which prevents knowing what node broadcasted what transaction in most cases

🙇 

 its only possible to try and steal your channel counterparty's sats.
and you're penalized if you try and they prove you are trying to cheat.

it's not something we hear a lot about... so I'm feeling like it's not a big problem?