it should be fine.
they take some getting used to but as long as you're healthy it'll be OK.

did you get kakebuton too?


delisting is good actually

🚀🚀🚀


How thick?

and shipped to where for how much?

excuse the questions,
I have several and they're getting old 🙏


this is a correct opinion


what kinda bed?


Ventoy is awesome
it makes it so easy


+1 for Standard Notes if you need syncing across devices


get it on Accreccent ❤


is relay.damus.io
one of your outbox relays?

thats where the bot is watching.


Rainer von Rilke


hey look.

he said the thing


it is!

probably!


fr

if you just tear the bandaid off quickly ita easier.

if you're really disciplined about no sugar and other simple carbs for 6mos you'll make a lot of progress


in terms of energy requirements,

a disinformation campaign about fluoride
!=
moving millions of tons of water with organized purpose over weeks

one of these is clearly possible,
the other isn't.

nostr:nevent1qqsfsqxlc39cszgu3hgvp9zxutcv3nk9g88hr97gf0xknd6n7c4kakgpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpr769xx


when conspiracy theorists jump the shark lol

never go full retard.


nah
not a thing
nostr:nevent1qqsfsqxlc39cszgu3hgvp9zxutcv3nk9g88hr97gf0xknd6n7c4kakgpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpr769xx


ohmygod
rofl


I'd still just use xmrig


considering the amount of total energy is thousands of atomic bombs worth,

there's no human technology to generate and direct such massive total energy

we can barely make a stable nuclear reaction, how tf are you gonna move all that water?


just use xmrig 👍


I know right?!

I'm convinced Lightning is just a settlement layer for ecash at this point lol


One factor is that he would have a powerful central position and could be pressured to make or endorse changes.

The whole idea is to have no central trusted parties. Therefore a central known founder is a problem.


objectively superior

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tQrN9ba8qEM


OK

There is something prior to the arising of the awareness of oneself.
Before there is even the idea "I am" and before arbitrary ideas about "wisdom" or whatever.

Thats what I am indicating.

In that "place" there are no differences.


probably took me 2 years to kick sugar.
depends on how bad you've screwed up your gut fauna I think.


What Is

is always
and always has been

it isn't the product of anything.
it is eternal and unchanging 🙏


Citadel Dispatch: CD14: lightning powered gaming with @andreneves and @sputn1ck

holy shit that was 3.5yrs ago

https://serve.podhome.fm/episode/8029725b-0319-44b9-4793-08dc404e83a4/6384559584059868655d2d9b7c-a9aa-4647-a9f0-9ffd78d48c0ev1.mp3


Matt had a CD on this long ago.
lemme see if I can find it.


yeah ❤

i don't agree complete transparency is something to brag about.
although there's lots of nuance to discuss there.


pretty sure she's one of my ex girlfriends 😬


Bitcoin is not fungible.

Utxos with different histories are nonfungible by definition.


Wen polls?


My teacher would say
"practice is taking off your colored glasses and seeing What Is"


have a generator?

my mom in Tampa just told me it was Cat2.
i think she's all "dont believe the lying media" 😐


I checked out in about 2004 and didn't really get back into it until 2016.
missed the entire mobile revolution. thankfully.

But its always been as you say,
now or in the BBS days.


sweet

that is so so helpful 🙏


The thread is just about the hypocrisy of Maxis using USD-denominated measurements when it suits their narrative,
but shitting on fiat measurements the rest of the time.

I was shocked to learn that they, in fact, don't understand unit of account at all.

oh
and how does Bitcoin magazine play into it?


There's no way to compare *any* two assets except through USD.

That's the problem.

We need an energy-based unit of account in order to have accurate pricing.
Until we have that, pricing is fucked.


That was probably it. I'll try again.

I didn't have it as an outbox Relay and just as a general relay.


This is also super useful to know if you are learning Japanese since many Japanese people speak in the passive voice and you have to figure the subject out through context.

also lol
the lotion is put in the basket


what did I do wrong here?
nostr:nevent1qqstmmllcm5ha435s0df88njqwacyqggjd39l75termc38z2rdx0rqgpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpse4uvh


minibits?
not technically LN but works


I will reflect on it 😜


its probably OS level tracking.
Google device? iOS?
Windoze?

not nostr.


No.
Bitcoin didn't just spring into being like some suddenly discovered natural phenomena.

it is the result of decades of theory and careful implementation.

which is obviously an invention. stop trying to lean on divine authority to rationalize maximalism.


to put it another way,
it isn't that the fixed number of monetary units which is important,

its that the monetary policy itself is known and resistant to pressure.


I gotta agree.
I live offgrid and am one of the few people who didn't have a terrible experience with compass.

Although once the asics had paid for themselves I terminated the contract.

It IS a trusted 3rd party and that's objectionable.


after a while I just felt like i had to pick one.
nostr:nprofile1qqsqfjg4mth7uwp307nng3z2em3ep2pxnljczzezg8j7dhf58ha7ejgpz4mhxue69uhkummnw3ex2mrfw3jhxtn0wfnszynhwden5te0wahhgtn4w3ux7tn0dejszxthwden5te0wdjkuerfwshxummnvekxzun99e3k7mgrcp7e2 has become quite the maxi

nostr:nevent1qqsqd8exd6x5f37q6qhv7rag6ygtx97yzwelmu7zhms499t7a0520dspzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgsqfjg4mth7uwp307nng3z2em3ep2pxnljczzezg8j7dhf58ha7ejgrqsqqqqqp6udvqs


orbit kinda sucks

maybe try Invizible


15' storm surge if you know anyone in Tampa https://i.nostr.build/EQbyGXC8GEcpVG1f.jpg


That's a litmus test for me.
If you can't critically evaluate your favorite coin, what are you even doing here?

The only reason Bitcoin got this far is because of critical thinking and preparing for adversarial situations. If we can't continue to do that, we're screwed.

Generally, Monero Bros are willing to talk about trade-offs critically. Bitcoin maxis not so much. lol

There are Monero Maxis though but maybe they stayed on Twitter?
theres nostr:nprofile1qqsyvh43xszdwgvumywzkj520ccg448qn0qjnrwq330wepfwn06a5zgpzemhxue69uhkummnw3ezu7rdwgh8ymmrddej7qghwaehxw309aex2mrp0yh8qunfd4skctnwv46z7qghwaehxw309aux6u3ww4ek2mn0wd68ytn0wfnj7gkl8f7 😂


which client?

i use mobile because Amethyst...


Kitty isn't putting up with my bullshit today

#catstr
https://i.nostr.build/JOEXoaWg1khfU0l9.jpg


jury is still out if BTC is a store of value too IMO

I'm just suggesting the community needs to prioritize privacy and censorship resistance over
"adoption, NGU and bitcoin is inevitable"


gotta have both to be sure.


aren't all start9 services Tor only until the next big release?

have you tried using Orbit or Invizible to route the Bitwarden app over Tor?


nostr:nprofile1qqsxcw0vzawc9smmwmavsm5zdjmuphxycha2zyqflq9mypzpwmxtgagpzdmhxue69uhhqatjwpkx2urpvuhx2ue0s42smw

Translate to English

nostr:nevent1qqst06fdnymcxn4xmssm7zr04aldj88rr99xkvtpcpqe086cwlsj6mcpzemhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumt0wd68ytnsw43z7q3qsxgnpqfyd5vjexj4j5tsgfc826ezyz2ywze3w8jchd0rcshw3k6sxpqqqqqqznk7scs


maybe in a perfect world
but until Bitcoiners get their shit together we still need Monero


show your work or GTFO

If I'm wrong (always possible)
I'm wrong because of a reason

a reason that someone should be able to express.

still waiting.


hey fuck you
i wrote all of these myself and they make a specific point.

your response says nothing except a generic "something will happen because of reasons"

its doesn't matter if you don't think about fiat at all.
its a fact that prices are denominated in fiat.

that shouldn't be a contentious statement among people who supposedly understand the basic principles of money.


finally. cheers.

exactly, right now we are setting prices in fiat.
setting prices in BTC means we are setting them in "energy equivalency units"
or price of block production.

and totally, the exact methodology for *how* the underlying UoA changes is probably way too complicated for any one person to understand.

I think when smaller communities can be more self-reliant and interact with fiat less
they will naturally set prices in a UoA they value more.

i mean,
that not my idea that's basic Mises


The idea the Bitcoin is inevitable is the biggest obstacle to its success.


and ト is an A? huh?


hell of a stretch lol


lived off the grid and drank the water from my spring
cooked a steak from my local guy
mined monero with our solar power
repaired the road to the 10 acres below mine
hung out with the neighbor when his truck went by

just life.


(and I also have bitcoin)

because you know,
I'm not a maxi zealot asshole.


my monero stack is up 250%
please don't be concerned


mmmm
weddings are for brides?


the meaning is not separate from the path itself.


That is pretty clearly the world that we are moving into and exactly why it's important that everybody does their best to opt out of dragnet surveillance.


To elaborate on this point I would like to refer the reader to Ludwig von Mises "Theory of Money and Credit"
pg 48, Money as a Price Index

"Nowadays exchange is usually carried on by means of money, and since every
commodity has therefore a price expressible in money, the exchange-
value of every commodity can be expressed in terms of money. This
possibility enabled money to become a medium for expressing values when the growing elaboration of the scale of values which resulted from the development of exchange necessitated a revision of the technique of valuation.
That is to say, opportunities for exchanging induce the individual
to rearrange his scales of values. A person in whose scale of values the
commodity 'a cask of wine' comes after the commodity 'a sack of oats' will reverse their order if he can exchange a cask of wine in the market for a commodity that he values more highly than a sack of oats. The position of commodities in the value-scales of individuals is no longer determined solely by their own subjective
use-value, but also by the subjective use-value of the commodities that can be obtained in exchange for them, whenever the latter stand higher than the former in the estimation of the individual. Therefore, if he is to obtain the maximum utility from his resources, the individual must familiarize himself with all the prices in the market.
For this, however, he needs some help in finding his way among the confusing multiplicity of the exchange-ratios. Money, the common medium of exchange, which can be exchanged for every commodity
and with which every commodity can be procured, is pre-eminently suitable for this. It would be absolutely impossible for the individual, even if he were a complete expert in commercial matters, to follow
every change of market conditions and make the corresponding alterations in his scale of use- and exchange-values, unless he chose some common denominator to which he could reduce each exchange-
ratio. Because the market enables any commodity to be turned into money and money into any commodity, objective exchange-value is expressed in terms of money. Thus money becomes a price-
index, in Menger's phrase."


It's crazy that just saying
"USD is the world unit of account"
is a controversial statement.
nostr:nevent1qqs2u9dy0t43xmp9xhj0cyv4x7raavjcvy7h8t4lu8em7q8xppddwyqpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsygyxxvrnhpt8m2t66yvlahvhzc254g5rydxtklfg65f3m2s805w00gpsgqqqqqqsmetmll


yeah it didn't come across

also,
Show your work or GTFO.


You have so-called Bitcoin Maxis who are trying to shit on Monero by showing USD denominated charts.

which *at best* only graphs speculative interest by Cantillionaires.

fiat valuation is either a bullshit metric
or it isn't.

it isn't a hard money chart because you divided by the current fiat valuation of BTC.

nostr:nevent1qqsytjshsx7na9jfehhlrzmrckmdf4x3qdvchnyyvlmpamu33ggycugppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsrc4vssrmywp62vw8fe3k5cjr6q6l6hqgyq24tnfnef76f5pf320srqsqqqqqphmt7j4


So you have so-called Bitcoin Maxis who are trying to shit on Monero by showing a USD denominated chart.

which *at best* only graphs speculative interest by Cantillionaires.

It's a pretty spectacular self-own.
not that they mean to. It's just lazy thinking that suits their confirmation bias.


I'm called them fiat maxis because they're showing price charts as if USD valuation matters.
I don't think the *really Fiat Maxis, they just don't understand that they're showing a Fiat chart because they misunderstand Unit of Account.

The Unit of Account is how we compare the value of two assets.

It's just a fact that the USD is the world Unit of Account.

I don't think that's how it should be.
but that's how it is.

You or I or anyone doing division in their head doesn't change that.

Until we get a bitcoin standard accurate pricing is impossible.


.......
bitcoin has the most speculators...?


dont waste your time


??
nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8eshfsjxtusp0pwxw8xxzm2a8u8mjq047pkc2hmm5ec6kwykvmhvpsgqqqqqqs52wwe7


the whole point of my rant is
"you can't value assets accurately on a fiat UoA"


Seems obvious
but apparently many Bitcoiners think they can change unit of account by doing division in their head.

nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8eshfsjxtusp0pwxw8xxzm2a8u8mjq047pkc2hmm5ec6kwykvmhvpsgqqqqqqs52wwe7


the denominator is USD *price* homie

its not the same.

as the USD denominated price of an asset changes
the trading pairs fluctuate accordingly.


just my old shit huh?

damn it


intellectual honesty ?


why does Bluetooth still suck so bad?

or it just i don't have modern gadgets?


how is Twitter?


as a Monero privacy guy
I'm gonna go with... what's the one?

Dero.


I mean... right?!
jfc

I'm still astonished


or at least one
for backup purposes


its out of control

nostr:nevent1qqs2pgaq6k85g6qtxt0pvwlr4egmfvxc3rcwxv7pt00glf2zhvgjtcspz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8eshfsjxtusp0pwxw8xxzm2a8u8mjq047pkc2hmm5ec6kwykvmhvpsgqqqqqqsmre0k7


You'd have to have Citrine running your own relay
even if just for backups...
probably?


been a while
nice to see you 😀


OK well
I'll just use 0xchat for DMs for now


makes sense.


oh of course


tokens are unique to the wallet...?


right
I want to use the same wallet because I don't want to end up with a half dozen ecash wallets.
one for each app.


I added the mint I use but how to add the account?
for example
ive received zaps in the minibits mint
and I can add minibits mint to 0xchat
but the tokens ive received aren't there.


also
getting a hardened_malloc error opening Discovery.
on Graphene obvs


Can I use my minibits wallet instead of the builtin one?


+1 for beef, butter, bacon and eggs

some fermented non starchy vegetables are good too


Hey nostr:nprofile1qqs9ajjs5p904ml92evlkayppdpx2n3zdrq6ejnw2wqphxrzmd62swspzemhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuvrcvd5xzapwvdhk6qgdwaehxw309aukzcn49ekk2qghwaehxw309aex2mrp0yh8x6tpd4ehgu3wvdhk6ynf30t
can I use my minibits wallet instead in-app?


self-sovereign censorship resistant money in action!

nostr:nevent1qqsw48ll0lh044qvrsh768y7ggf0ejfm9d8lf0wmqtmue3nfz6vy9psppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsdgvut0sesvjgulh65j9x3554cp2t9dp0hxcf3r6h9704078fr5kcrqsqqqqqpqt64xf


meh
KYC all the way

use cash instead


I think all small-scale mining is for self-sovereignty
and for fun, of course.
Everybody would very much appreciate you helping to decentralize Bitcoin mining.

But from a simply economic viewpoint, you're probably better off just spending money and buying Bitcoin.
Certainly if you attach a USD value to your time.


yeah not an accurate metaphor I think

its a multisig arrangement right?
so you have to be sure there is enough locked up to be able to settle on mainchain.
iow you need to *also have a key to sign for received sats


yeah not accurate I think

its a multisig arrangement right?
so you have to be sure there is enough locked up to be able to settle on mainchain.
iow you need to *also have a key to sign for received sats


I guess fiat-minded Keynesians made up the idea that money is used as UoA

maxis know best of course
🤡

nostr:nevent1qqsr3p37jzf9s423nc4rewv3fps5pf5pqx4z75dyyflsvj5rdsp6ljspzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36crqsqqqqqpslkfws


I see now why this guy avoids discussions and just posts memes

obviously the exchange pair would move if the new USD went into either BTC or XMR...
SMH
nostr:nevent1qqs9zyrms66jaxx4gucgg9wu994dtrev6zncml6txr5eeqew6y7txvgpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36crqsqqqqqp6j9dxt


its the arbitrage between exchange pairs that force the exchange rate to follow the relative fiat price.

because degens jump in to get free fiat trading the pair.


no.
obviously incorrect.

if the pair fluctuates away from the underlying UoA price

about a million traders notifications go off and they jump into the cheaper asset
flip to the other and sell
for free fiat

this is why it matters what the UoA is,
because as the most salable good
everyone ends up trying to get it.

you aren't learning.
nostr:nevent1qqsyte02494s67k633vu8pc90y69ns3ss9drfkjl6ktc2npwgqgdv2spr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqp66pqqd


well
for one

the main thing that makes the USD different is that it is the *most saleable good*. accepted practically anywhere.

that is another of the primary characteristics that makes it "money"
and bottles of water are not because they are only salable based in their utility

that is why prices are *accounted* in USD. and not something else.

so
while i see your point
it doesn't really express the reality of the situation

people *account* in USD *units* because it is universally saleable.

that is just how the world is
not saying it *should* be this way
but its a fact.


lol
cool bro

you're right
economies dont use a UoA

Keynesians made it up lol


you're gonna have to explain why this is "made up nonsense"

nostr:nevent1qqszl333f2xz3tnv9nhr30msd73u8vr52d4jm6ugvr3ygn4xvmvj0dqpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpxkhm3x


show youe work or GTFO

People use a *unit of account* to make value comparisons between two assets.

This is econ101 shit.


the exchange rate of a pair follows the *prices* of each individual asset,
as measured in the dominant Unit of Account.

because otherwise degens can jump into one asset
flip to the other
and sell for free fiat.

this action forces the trading pair to follow the USD prices of the assets.

All assets
and all charts,
we are going to mention here
are USD denominated.

nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8eshfsjxtusp0pwxw8xxzm2a8u8mjq047pkc2hmm5ec6kwykvmhvpsgqqqqqqs52wwe7


Not sure thats applicable to Monero but is interesting.
for small payments its probably still fine....?


Introducting trusted 3rd parties should be a last-resort option for scaling
and that shouldn't be a contentious statements among bitcoiners.

instead y'all are super excited to normalize it.


and yay!
you just created BTC denominated bank runs in cyberspace!

progress!


Ok so let’s do something new now #Nostr 👀

Before, I did a #Christian #Bitcoin follow train — but now let’s do a #Monero #follow train going.

It’s not just growth for me, but for everyone else that interacts with this. Let’s make some new connections and follow each other :)

#grownostr


My asshole cat claws stuff to get my attention when she hasn't been fed.

Like dude, I know you ate a mouse in the middle of the night. I heard the crunching.


I don't have it...

Simplex?


"save in Bitcoin, spend in Monero"
is a perfectly sensible approach.

The only comment I would make is,
you don't want to just be moving into Monero just when you need to spend. It makes you vulnerable to timing analysis of the exchanges.

It's better to keep a stack that you top up occasionally.


totally.
The goal is all prices are denominated in BTC.

But like you say, that's not happening anytime soon.


cheers
nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpezkzts


What does it mean to be "100% off the USD" if you have to interact with it?
nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpezkzts


fiat metrics are mostly irrelevant
nostr:nevent1qqsx94969d6yqlu0ngrkp7c2qcd5mmkxpk89y3wnmnf9nwyv72spn0gpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpezkzts


nice looking client


well at least we have a working theory 🤨


The address mostard sees in my profile is not a manually inputted one.
which is why I'm guessing its from a published nostr event Garnet did.


is that the same address I sent to?


That's just a guess on how it's working though.


Totally confusing. As best as I understand it Mostard is reading the addresses that Garnet published.

they were published once, and there's no way to delete them even if you don't use that wallet anymore. because nostr.


Kayabanerve on Matrix

"FCMP++ is compatible with the existing address protocol and Carrot, which reuses the same address format (despite a distinct one-time address derivation/TX data protocol)."

Existing addresses will continue to work as-is after FCMP are forked in 😎


but you have Garnet somewhere?


sent from mostard....?
it doesn't have a wallet?

sent from my mobile wallet.


yeah but I have one in my own profile in mostard
and I'm not running Garnet anymore

but maybe its leftover...

dont sent any back
I don't have access to that wallet anymore since there was no way to backup/restore those Garnet wallets


his pod, Rabbit Hole Recap

I'm told its rather popular...


"Odell"
"RHR"
all of it

time to change identities.


it seems to work pretty well most of the time
but yeah,

a little unclear on the specifics


THE MOST IMPORTANT NEW LIFE SKILL IS PRIVATE KEY CONTROL.

SOCIETY WHEN WE HAVE LARGE SCALE SELF-CUSTODIAL PRIVKEYS

https://i.nostr.build/eNReN0VVk4jMygrl.gif


original Trek is the best Trek
 https://i.nostr.build/9JdnZfx2YMrxaKrx.jpg

https://i.nostr.build/3wT7ghmKL2rfmrwd.gif


fr 😕


I think mass adopting nonprivate custodial solutions is ok if it increases my net worth 300%


but I have a XMR address on my profile...?
from where?

and I supposedly sent you .02 XMR?


wasn't a very good wallet tbh and the fork was so far behind Amethyst
the relay management was still awful...

I'll try mostard but I want the nostr event when zaps happen


Hmm.. been using the moStard NOSTR client on the browser. It works really good, things just work. I enjoy customizing the reactions to posts and remove those who I didn't like/use.

Quite a solid client. Plus that I can zap directly with Monero. Just add your monero address on the profile and you become zappable. The future is bright.

https://mostard.org/


Store nsec in nos2x?


lol
I'm happy for you ❤

just pointing out that if fiat is garbage,
its always garbage


yeah I get more like 80/15

but I'm also connecting through two VPNs 🤔


word 😎
gamechanger


goddamn it dude
now I gotta add a 10k option


equal inputs or GTFO


lol
I'm happy for you ❤

just pointing out that is fiat is garbage,
its always garbage


just burn it and put the effort into a nym bro

you'll be happier


cool

nostr:nevent1qqs2yn929pm4hcvatge9l3aklxecel2rd6gwq2x0z46l8jq9ppy7rccpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpp7xaqd


yep
pretty much


I have never shit on bitcoin
I just talk about it's lack of privacy and other tradeoffs it makes

I do the same with monero and try to be intellectually consistent.

the most unpopular position of all lol


I love buying things in BTC or XMR.
prices may still be denominated in USD originally but it's a good first step.

as communities become more self-reliant and not needing to interact with fiat as much,
they can start to price goods purely in what they themselves value.


100 tabs of acid for .8 XMR


For real.

And it only stops when we are using a Unit of Account,
iow,
*pricing real goods in*
a unit with predictable, known monetary policy.

I imagine there would still be speculative fevers on new commodities and new news,
natural disasters etc
but generally prices would just be known and stable. Maybe for generations.

It would change everything.


I never said anything about that.
Sure you might be right.

That would be a better world with MUCH more accurate pricing.

You can't price accurately on a fiat UoA.
Which is the point on the conversion and something bitcoin maxis agree with,

except when fiat charts confirm their perspective on the inevitability of Bitcoin.

*Those* charts are an extremely correct hard money measurement 🙄


bitcoin maxis : "Prices are fucked and inflation is theft! Fiat is garbage! Tar and feather Gerome Powell! Burn the Fed to the ground!"

also bitcoin maxis : "if I divide a dollar price by (BTC/USD) I'm measuring with sound money"

🤡


uh huh
tell yourself whatever you need to get through the day I guess

otherwise,
show your fucking work. anyone can talk shit.

doing division in your head doesn't change the unit of account.

you're dividing by USD *denominated* prices for gods sake. are you retarded?


don't feel bad bro

nostr:nprofile1qqsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36cpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qy2hwumn8ghj7enjv4h8xtn4w3ux7tn0dejj7qg4waehxw309aex2mrp0yh82arcduhx7mn99ueat4s3 doesn't know what UoA is either

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Episode 4 of "Bitcoin Maxis Have No Idea What a Unit of Account Is"

has just been released!!!

dont forget to like and subscribe!!
------------------------------

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When you compare the prices of two assets
in a graph
using the US dollar for comparison
(because thats what prices are)
you are using the USD as "a unit of account"
because it is the common unit of valuation.

another example,
people offering to accept payment in BTC
measure the amount of BTC they'll accept in USD
(because thats what prices are)

in these situations,
USD is called the "unit of account"
(because thats what prices are measured on)

and it doesn't change because you do some division in your head.

it isn't anybody elses fault you don't know what words mean.


literally all my post says is
"the US dollar is the unit of account"

and you're trying to make it into some tribal Monero/Bitcoin thing

get fucked


present company excepted apparently...


Nobody said otherwise bro.
who tf are you talking to?


While it's true that you can have local units of account they all come back to the USD. sorry Australia.

We can certainly argue that exceptions are made for countries that do not participate in the United States dollar homogeny. You mentioned BRICS.
I think there are some nuances there, but basically you're right.


That isn't what a Unit of Account is dude.


Episode 3 of "Bitcoiners Not Knowing What A Unit of Account is!!"
------------------------------------------
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show your work or GTFO


bye


That's what Unit of Account is.
The one that's so popular all goods are *denominated* in it.


That's what Unit of Account is.
The one that's so popular all goods are priced in it.


I might trade weed for propane,
and the exchange rate might be geographically different,
but generally speaking
the rate is always track with the USD fiat denomination of each asset.

USD denominated
because that's the Units most things are Accounted for in.

Any time the unit pair deviates from the underlying UOA values, it's an opportunity for a trader to step in and make free fiat.

If weed is cheap versus propane, I can buy weed, flip it to propane, and sell it for free fiat.
This action *forces* the trading pair to tend towards the underlying fiat UOA values.

Basic economics.


cool


cya


use your brain or GTFO

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you are welcome to do whatever you like.

but the fact is,
the world denominates things in USD.

just a fact.
sorry not sorry.


never seen the electrical one 🤨


umm awkward
😬


BREAKING
–------------------------–
Bitcoin Maxis Don't Know What Unit of Account Is
_-------------------------_
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BREAKING
–------------------------–
Bitcoiners Don't Know What Unit of Account Is
_-------------------------_
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I believe you must be an intelligent person, so this must be willful ignorance or something.

A common unit of account is how we determine relative prices between two items.
I CAN decide to price sats or anything else in big Macs or ballpoint pens if I want. It's mostly meaningless to anyone else because there's no common frame of reference.

In actual fact, one bottle of water is about 0.25 BigMacs ( Depending on your geographical region, of course)
But the ONLY reason that ratio is reached is because of their fundamental unit of account, the US dollar.
*What the goods are priced in*

You don't get away from the unit of account just because you're measuring against a different commodity. The UoA is the unit that you're using to do the comparison with.

I mean, this is like super obvious.


BREAKING
–------------------------–
Bitcoiners Don't Know What Unit of Account Is
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and this is not a good thing

but monero *is pretty fucking cool


The USD Denominates Everything
---------------

Because apparently it needs to be said,

the only reason you can make the conversion BTC->XMR
or to whatever

is because you have an underlying UoA denomination to compare them with.

its the US dollar.
it denominates everything.

you are comparing
two USD denominated prices.

the price of one thing.
as measured in USD.
against.
the price of another thing.
as measured in USD.

A comparison of the relative FIAT value of two things,
that is what a price graph is.
As long as the UoA is the US dollar.

Fiat measurement.


that isn't correct.

with zero knowledge proofs you can prove something without seeing it.
like "the sum of the inputs and outputs of this transaction equal zero"

lemme ask ya
how do you verify the supply now?


dude you have to stop fronting like this.

there was never any Ringsig connection to an inflation bug.

there WAS a bug in the ring selection algorithm that allowed statistical correlation of the decoys IF you were spending a fresh output

so please.
change the PFP?


inflation of what?
as measured in what?

you think that's air you're breathing?


DO IT!


that's wonderful.

there is only one thing thats required:
don't give up.


bucks rubbing their antlers?

I'd wrap it in damp moss if you have any mossy trees or springs around


The USD Denominates Everything
---------------

Because apparently it needs to be said,

the only reason you can make the conversion BTC->XMR
or to whatever

is because you have an underlying UoA denomination to compare them with.

its the US dollar.
it denominates everything.

you are comparing
two USD denominated prices.

the price of one thing.
as measured in USD.
against.
the price of another thing.
as measured in USD.

A comparison of the relative FIAT value of two things,
that is what a price graph is.
As long as the UoA is the US dollar.


lol I tried send you some sats to pay them with

the only reason you can make the conversion BTC->XMR
or to whatever

is because you have an underlying UoA denomination to compare them with.

its the US dollar.
it denominates everything.

you are comparing
two USD denominated prices.

the price of one thing.
as measured in USD.
against.
the price of another thing.
as measured in USD.

fiat graph.


I'd crew that ship


I think mass adopting nonprivate custodial solutions is ok if it increases my net worth 300%


I hope you have someone to occasionally wipe the spittle off your chin

when the relative value of two things, as measured in US dollars, makes a graph. That graph is "denominated" in US dollars.

 https://i.nostr.build/Q4fgRQItsSfexPfd.jpg


nobody ever said nothing has measurable value.

I'm saying fiat is a trash metric to measure value.
which bitcoiners usually agree with.

except when their confirmation bias gets in the way.


trade bitcoin for it


Both assets priced in USD.
Fiat graph.

its not hard.

also,
my monero stack is up 250%
please don't be concerned. https://i.nostr.build/bcYVkjATlHnJyOP6.jpg


Show me where I claimed I did or anybody should. I'll wait.

I'm just pointing out that it's a Fiat denominated graph.

(which is fucking elementary school math and it's unbelievable that it's turned into this kind of discussion)


(Gotta be consistent with my reply guying 😅)


ecash is cool but I prefer self-custody

because... you know
I believe in first principles and I'm not a religious fanatic


yeah your meaning was clear.

unfortunately they took it as an opportunity to derail the convo

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


you can do whatever the fuck you want and nobody cares

but the world prices shit in USD and you doing division in your head doesn't change that.


I didn't say it was


I believe you must be an intelligent person, so this must be willful ignorance or something.

A common unit of account is how we determine relative prices between two items.
I CAN decide to price sats or anything else in big Macs or ballpoint pens if I want. It's mostly meaningless to anyone else because there's no common frame of reference.

In actual fact, one bottle of water is about 0.25 BigMacs ( Depending on your geographical region, of course)
But the ONLY reason that ratio is reached is because of their fundamental unit of account, the US dollar.
*What the goods are priced in*

You don't get away from the unit of account just because you're measuring against a different commodity. That's the unit that you're using to do the comparison with.

I mean, this is like super obvious.


Let me put that in a different way

it isn't statistically useful to measure the performance of a brand new asset class over the course of a decade.

I'm not saying it's a totally meaningless data point but it isnt super useful either.


you didn't look very far https://i.nostr.build/cu8W8KQDjEYC6y0c.jpg


dumb comment
the whole point is its still USD denominated.

because BTC and any other asset you name is priced in USD.
which is what "denominated" means.

There are no Bitcoin-denominated charts.


Did you seriously look at the dictionary and cherry pick a definition??
damn dude, how do you cope with the intellectual dishonesty?

that graph is of the function

(XMR/USD)÷(BTC/USD)

know your units 😘

also here
first hit from the Cambridge Dictionary https://i.nostr.build/kHp3sxVBo4MuvfyC.jpg


the UoA is what the goods are priced in.
and yes it ends up being the denominator.

as in
(ASSET/USD)÷(BTC/USD)

is USD denominated.


eggs are priced in dollars
SATs are priced in dollars

its only because they have a common UoA pricing in sats is possible

super basic Econ, principles of money stuff here


(eggs/USD)÷(sat/USD)

still fiat denominated


that isn't what we're talking about


not "value" methinks, its "price"

value is in the eye of the beholder.
price is the local representation of the value as rendered in a unit of account.


You're exactly right. Thank you for helping.


You can arbitrarily start pricing them any way you like. But nobody particularly cares what you or I think, or how we price them.
The fact is, society is already pricing them using a unit of account.

They are all,
Bitcoin, eggs, milk, electricity, bread and water whatever
they are all denominated already in a unit of account.

You and I don't change that by doing division.

It's also irrelevant if the price is slightly different in a different geographical area. Or if it's actually great British pounds rather than US dollars, the unit of accounts still is the same.


It only takes 10,000 sats to buy a carton of eggs because USD is the UoA of each item.

If it wasn't for bullshit fiat measurements of each asset, we have no idea what the price would be.


This is indeed when we get a stable yardstick and can price goods accurately.

In the meantime, as long as USD is the price that fundamental Units things are Accounted, no price can be represented without fiat taint.

Sometimes the taint is very small, like in the case of locally bought eggs. Sometimes it is very large, as in the case of Amazon stock or Tesla.


It's only going up because USD is pouring into BTC.
(ANYTHING/USD)÷(BTC/USD)
$ANYTHING goes down as more USD chases BTC.
Still USD denominated.

The price of eggs or any other commodity you care to name is,
the local valuation of eggs divided by the USD cost of that commodity.

iow, USD denominated.

Sure, we can get into other local UOA's, but we know that virtually all of them come back to USD.


Thank you! JFC.

Although I want to point out that that's not strictly accurate either, because most exchange order books currency pairs are direct and not through fiat.

But the rub is that because
a million degens are watching those pairs travel precisely in tandem with the fluctuations of fiat price of each asset.

Because if they don't, it's trivial to jump into one asset and flip into the other and sell. POOF FREE FIAT.

So because of this pressure, all commodity pairs fluctuate tracking with the USD equivalent price of each. They are de facto USD denominated.

Because that's the unit of account that everybody is trying to get.

this is one of the main reasons why we need a Bitcoin unit of account.


jfc you too?

again.
that is a fiat denominated chart.

it is a graph of the function
(XMR/USD)÷(BTC/USD)

there are no BTC denominated charts while USD is the unit of account because *that's what prices are*

everybody in the world is using USD as a uoa but bitcoiners think they can change it by doing division lol


now if EVERYONE IN WORLD is measuring it in feet (a Unit of Account)
and you decide to measure it in meters

you haven't changed the unit of account.

Now they change the definition of "feet" to be 20% longer.
Six weeks later they change it to be 10% more than that.
then after a little while they ot goes down 7%.
So you adjust your "meters" 20% more
and 10% more
and 7% less

because the *underlying Unit of Account* has changed.

This is exactly what you're doing with the underlying US dollar price of Bitcoin in relationship to any other good you might name.

its true that the distance traveled (UTXOs) haven't changed
all that's changed is the arbitrary fiat assessment of "value"

which is the whole point of what I'm saying.
the yardstick is arbitrary bullshit.


If people want to do that, it's fine.

They should be clear that they're holding Bitcoin for fiat buying power and not larp about freedom money.
Its an untenable position for a so-called bitcoiner.


omg
for real?

Doing division is not changing the unit of account.


Any individual can do whatever they want. I'm not contesting that.

The point is, is that they are all already measured in USD because that's what the UOA is.
A UOA is not a personal thing. A UOA is what a *society prices goods in.*

The price of all commodities and all other currencies are set against USD.
And if a pairing EVER deviates from that, traders jump in to pull them back in line.
Because there's a million traders waiting for a deviation to happen so that they can get fiat.


See, was thst so hard?

The unit of account is *what prices are set in*

the prices of ALL of that stuff is set in USD

so please explain
how exactly dividing the USD price of oil by the USD price of Bitcoin is not a fiat USD-based measurement.


Still waiting for you to say one intelligent word.


You are dividing the US dollar price of one thing by the US dollar price of another thing.
That does NOT change the unit of account.

are you for real??


Homie has me muted so he doesn't know that I've held Bitcoin for eight years also.


Honestly cannot believe that you guys think that dividing the US dollar price of one thing by the US dollar price of another thing changes the unit of account.

like wow.
and you consider yourselves literate in economics?


I love how all of our threads turn into debunking Monero FUD and there's always one person who's like, "tell me more about how that works."


sigh

again
if you think dividing the US dollar price of one thing,
by the US dollar price of another thing,

changes the unit of account
then you need to review Econ101.

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I'm not contesting you can buy more steaks if fiat speculators pump your bags.

It just doesn't change the unit of account.


iow
until there is a hard money UOA,
pricing is fucked.


exactly

durrr
the unit of account is ribeyes because i did division
durrr


nice story bro
you don't personally change the UOA because you divide by 69K.
That really is retarded.

The UOA is what *prices are set in*, which is USD.

for example,

(ETH/USD)÷(BTC/USD)
is a USD denominated chart

get it straight.

https://i.nostr.build/LzDRiFea6QQjh9yr.jpg


another bitcoiner who doesnt understand UoA.

AGAIN
THERE ARE NO BITCOIN DENOMINATED CHARTS
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wtf do you think "purchasing power" is measured in moron?
except the unit of account?


I thought this was what you meant.
its moronic.

what are you agreeing with?


You can't measure the performance of a SoV over a decade.


Monero absolutely has lost USD denominated purchasing power as degen speculators have continued to pile into bitcoin.

Feature, not a bug.

and anybody with a Guy Fawkes mask should know that.
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Altcoins aren't mixing anything with bitcoin so the metaphor doesnt apply.

like,
at all.

How about
"people believing other things debase my beliefs"
"the existence of white people debase the brown people"

it makes no fucking sense.


*as measured in USD.
which is a bullshit measurement.

congratulations you're a fiat maxi.


given widespread adoption, CPU infrastructure is also more resilient than ASIC.


Poorer in terms of what?

You're measuring in fiat, something that you say is bullshit half the time and only bring out to rely on when you want to shit on Monero and other assets.


All this chart says is that fiat degens piled into Monero for a brief period in 2017 and then left,
but that they *continue to pile into BTC.

Having VC and fiat speculation interested is not the mic drop that you think it is.


CISA plz ser


I'm implying that,
you have no way to verify those things did occur
and no way to establish causal connection to DJT policy.

you're just taking it on faith because some man on a screen somewhere said so


reject USD equiv price

price real goods in BTC only


Afraid that this no-money socialist utopia will turn out to be a fad


yep


GFY 😀


GFY


The idea that "Bitcoin is inevitable" is in fact its greatest enemy.


OK
nice story bro


like these supposed bitcoiners that are obsessed with fiat price. smdh

the culture has changed and the priorities have become USD denominated.

"something something Trojan horse"
but they really just get off on imagining themselves as the new 1%, with fabulous USD-eqiv buying power and saying "I told you so" to everyone who got in later.

its pretty nasty and not why I got interested in this technology.

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achuually

REAL advocates of freedom money celebrate VC and other degenerate fiat speculators coming in and pumping their bags.
those advocating for privacy and censorship resistance can HFSP

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I think privacy is a necessary characteristic of censorship resistance.
I DON'T care if that censorship resistant chain is bitcoin or monero.

But in its current form bitcoin isn't going to be freedom money.

also I found monero first so its my first love anyway 😆


up about 250% thanks


Thw cypherpunk ethos that makes people use nostr instead of twitter
is the same ethos that make people endorse Monero over Bitcoin.

(love bitcoin but tbh, the dominant culture these days is cucked)


😁
I've been reflecting on how I interact with people on social media.


wish I could help 😕


restrictive how?


The preconfigured defaults didn't "autojoin you to several default channels one of which is #dev where we have weekly meetings, and where the community is most active and talks about DarkFi development?"

./darkirc?


sugar cravings are normal when not drinking.

keep it up allstar


just use Mullvad and/or IVPN


OPs argument is a little weird.
not sure how using Monero is "debasing bitcoin."

also
"I'd rather use a custodial trusted system than self-sovereign money on a different chain"
seems like a religious argument,
and not a convincing mic drop.


Confused

using Monero is "debasing bitcoin?"
what's the logic here?


No I understand that.
Also certainly common sense that systems that don't have this sort of quantifiable metadata can be more private.

But also, as it is right now,
maybe just private because nobody is looking.


interesting take. Thanks for writing that all out.

It seems like the jury is still out on it.
I'm not sure how much the privacy gained is just "private because nobody is looking."

did you see this one?
https://d.nostr.build/0ua3oxgiHkycwJz8.pdf


badass


are you using a nostr client that supports deterministic builds?
or verifying the relays you connect to?

I mean
same goes for every single piece of software we run.
unless you build it yourself and verify the hash you are placing trust somewhere.

dunno why exactly Simplex should be more sus


This is sick 🙏


I don't mind if that's how they incentivize people to help secure their network *if it works.*
I'm just pointing out that it doesn't seem to have actually succeeded in doing that.

And as far as anybody can tell, it's only them running nodes, so it's basically a single centralized third party.

That said, I have used Session and it's improved a lot. The UX used to be terrible, but now it's pretty nice.
It just seems like their security model didn't work out the way they hoped it would.


bitwarden
if you need to sync between devices anyway


Also,
its bitcoiners that say that everything is good for Bitcoin. We didn't start it.


While web wallets are kind of dated, it's hard to see how this is a good thing.


fag


best take of yours ever


pretty sure he's got me muted so it doesn't matter what I say 😅


the 1st season of that show was epic


basically shes correct

you have no idea what other people are going through or what their experience of life is.

having a nasty judgmental takeaway just outs you as a small nasty man.


Is there any way to verify how many servers Session is running?
I don't think they're financial model (shitcoining) is working out for them and oxen is running them all.
I run my own Simplex relays.

AND they're not using double ratchet encryption. intercepted messages can be decrypted if an adversary gets access to the sending device.
Simplex uses model Signal encryption.

so a small number of servers run by a single entity not using modern encryption.

doesn't sound very secure to me.
I'd prefer a organization with a viable financial model.


We're monero guys so you can go ahead and dismiss our opinion

iow, we're FOSS only


Did the DM go through?


I don't know.
The main thing that comes to mind is,
okay, I lived in Japan for a long time. And people over there have a completely different conception of what it's like to be a human being.
Basically, few of them would agree with the assertion that they have these kinds of rights.

It's a very Western idea. It's a meme. I think it's a really good one and I also share that viewpoint. I just don't think that it applies to all human beings.

People also have the right to not have rights I guess lol

I think they're cultural and social, not inherent somehow in the human experience. You and I just personally think that it's a better way to be a human being.

And yeah, we have to fight for them and assert them against those that would infringe on what we consider our personal freedoms.

But it's really just our desire to live the way that we want to live. Not some inherent thing conferred on us by divine authority.


I lived in Japan for many years and never really saw it pay pay until i visited last time. I expect Japan to go very quickly to full digital payments, although it's been taking a surprisingly long time.


To quote Nick Szabo, "Monero is also good money."

It makes different trade-offs than BTC, of course, and there's certainly criticisms that you can make. Things like tail emission, which I think is an advantage.

it's secured by less energy than BTC is. Partially as a result of its decision to pursue asic-resistant mining algos.
So certainly not as resistant to a 51% attack and therefore less appealing as SOV.

But it fulfills the digital MOE space extremely well with a good UX. It's extremely difficult to screw up your privacy.

Also, despite these Maxis harping on about relative fiat value, It's actually held its own quite well. My Monero stack is up almost 300%. Not as much as my BTC stack, but what's the sense of being greedy?


That said, I created a burner Amazon account through VPN with a Simplelogin email and bought a Amazon gift card with Monero and ordered a new Pixel to my PO box.

So that was pretty cool.
and of course, VPS hosting, VPN etc


it is not true.

it is a situation of "regulation by prosecution."


TBH, the only time I actually desire competence from the federal government is for disaster relief.


He was incompetent and totally unprepared to do anything,
but I agree that an incompetent and evil government is better than a slightly-better-organized and evil one.

but now his backers have had 4 years to prepare and I expect them to be better organized and more evil this time around.


I am happy that my constant Monero shilling has not aggravated your maxi sensibilities LOL


Because the topology of the lightning network has become a hub and spoke arrangement with most traffic passing through a few large centralized nodes.


I expect it would have gone pretty much the same. Monero isn't really widely accepted IRL, afaict.

I live in rural America, where there's basically zero crypto-acceptance. Monero or otherwise.


Nisargaddata.


Except for not offering strong privacy.

How do I as a user calculate the Anon set that I'm hiding in when making an LN transaction?


They're not a fun to be in as matrix or XMPP groups though

particularly if they're onion routed


+1 for Simplex
nostr:nevent1qqs9funqscwsham0r2z4nx9usrg7d2w2z053pwj8995hewy6j0qyyespz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg9v8a40u96e8asczpgnmty6re2yapaee6gmylfhhz8vtra64yq54gpsgqqqqqqs04lz0t


They're running the servers though. They see the IP address you come in on and which hops you're going through.
All multi-hop does is increase the crowd that you're hiding in. not help you if the provider itself is compromised.

The only way to get around it is to use two VPN providers. I use mullvad on the router level, so all my traffic goes straight to them, and then to an IVPN multihop on top of that.
So they would both have to be working together in order to de-anomise my traffic.


Um... A VPN *always knows what website you visit.


We've never had such an entrenched and widely used UOA fail and moved to something else, have we?
It's really hard to imagine how that would happen. But I assume that hyperinflation does have something to do with it. The masses have to get and frustrated because it is an arbitrary yardstick.

which is exactly why I'm giving you a hard time about using the BTC-USD measurement as if it were actually BTC denominated.

people have to understand that the Bitcoin price is a fiat price. It isn't an index of "value."


Um, are you for real?
Give me an example please, cause off the top of my head I can't think of a single thing.


So not different for us than.

different for them because killing us just takes those UTXOs off the board.


If your ownership of your Bitcoin (or gold silver whatever) isnt a secret, how is it any different from owning property?


I never really understood where these were supposed to come from.
Because I'm not familiar of any place where God actually says that these things exist.
And it's pretty much just Americans and a certain variety of western European that feel like these are a thing at all.w

Rights are defended and asserted. They don't fall out of the sky.
What's wrong with just having them because we want them and think we *should have them?
An unsubstantiated appeal to divine authority seems unnecessary.


At a certain price level, it becomes obvious to everybody that you're just losing out trading your sats for any real-world commodity.

I haven't done the math but suppose far in the future the population of the Earth is 100 billion. suppose we have a lunar base and we're mining asteroids.

So, generally speaking, the total amount of wealth is 500 times what it is today. For example, And all of that is represented by sats.
I don't know what price point that puts us at, but it's extremely high and since Bitcoin is representing all total wealth, we know that it's only going to get higher.

In such a situation, nobody is going to be using Sats as an MOE.
They're already incredibly valuable and only going to be more so.
Anybody who has them can issue credit with them backing. Hopefully verifiably, but maybe not.

And anybody who doesn't have them is screwed.


Why should that be true?

The point is that as long as the UoA is USD, all prices are fiat denominated in the eend

Telling yourself, "this is BTC-denominated" just glosses over the fact that it's actually BTC-price denominated. Which of course is a USD price.

What we're after is a stable UOA that actually can be used to measure. Until we have that, no prices actually accurately measure the value of a commodity
only in an arbitrary fiat way.


It's extremely easy to imagine a dystopian future where there are two classes of people, early adopters, and everybody else.
particularly when there's a hard cap and no new supply is being issued.

Do you really imagine that when every sat is fantastically valuable and nobody in the right mind would ever trade them, that they will not end up issuing paper bitcoin?


It isn't a matter of perspective.

Here you are just measuring *relative USD-denominated value*
Obviously a fiat measurement.

Because it all comes back to US dollars and how many US dollars are chasing a particular commodity.
It isn't "converted into US dollars." It's ALREADY US dollars. And you're converting it into Bitcoin terms and pretending like its those.

More US dollars start chasing BTC faster than US dollars start chasing iPhones and its price goes down relative to Bitcoin. It's that simple.
Clearly USD denominated. It's amazing we even have to have this conversation.


this graph is the function

(iPhone)÷(BTC/USD)

as the USD price of Bitcoin increases the graph goes down.

All supposed Bitcoin-denominated charts are just graphs of the relative USD value of two commodities.

They are fiat denominated because that's what prices are.


Pretty sad that it got all this way through critical thinking and preparation for adversarial scenarios,
only to be hijacked by a bunch of religious zealots actively promoting the acceptance of retarded memes unthinkingly.


once again

THERE ARE NO BTC DENOMINATED CHARTS
nostr:nevent1qqsp8l2y7nzjaugl7v8zhld6mlygl7qry5f3nv9gunudytnakx7n0aqpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsygzxc75wu00ssem9ps9tqdms42ddxzwt9fz68cpuwckf0r8wvd47typsgqqqqqqskjuad2


because this chart is only how it is because the USD price increased.

it is still denominated in USD.


are there any other Kyoto people on nostr???


people should respond. Its basic politeness.

If they don't, its up to you whether to continue the relationship.

coming from another rural dude without any friends lol


at the risk of harping on the point,
unless you keep your ownership a secret
it isn't any different than owning land or something.

because it can be taxed
and if push comes to shove
confiscated.

if an asset can be confiscated at will by force,
in what sense does someone "own it?"
except in a provisional way.


Saylor and Fink etc institutional holders already know what the game is.

They're fiat maxis. As long as they're properly rewarded for getting in early, they're happy.


If the point is to confiscate an asset which is threatening the existing banking system, then of course it matters whether you give them the phrase or not.


By men with guns coming to your house and asking nicely.


booo
after 7 the series went to shit


#syli
#supportyourlocalinsurgency

courtesy of WarDoll
https://i.nostr.build/GzlgjmLWCRP9nz9G.jpg


there's an "incognito" button on the DM screen to turn on the giftwrap bit

did you flip that on?


Like an axe and a shovel had a baby


The fuck is wrong with that axe


because it's not just about the protocol.

Scalability is also about dominant culture surrounding the network. When we scale but what you have is a bunch of NGU de-gens coming in, then there's incentive in a particular direction.

For example, I'm pissed off because the NGU priority has meant that there's no good privacy on Bitcoin.
In fact, strong privacy is actually against the NGU philosophy, because those big money people won't come in if Bitcoin is antagonistic to government regulation.

So we end up in a situation where Bitcoin actually wants to play nice with regulators for the sake of NGU. Either by doing something or by NOT doing something.

So we have a situation where it isn't just technical scaling, but it's also cultural social scaling and the direction and incentives involved.

Maxis will write it off by just saying that Bitcoin is inevitable, which is just an excuse to rationalize NGU and their fantasies of being the new 1%.

</rant>


back away slowly bro


Price action is mostly VCs and fiat degens aping in in hopes of a return in fiat terms.
It's insane that anybody who's interested in freedom money would think it's relevant.

In fact, it's actively bad for Bitcoin.


Communism


70 days on my tanto.
how do you tell how much data has transferred?


I agree that the incentives are not aligned.

Also, it's just ridiculous that everybody's going to run their own lightning node. As far as I can tell, it's just going to be another layer for payments between large entities.
maybe people use e-cash and all the lightning stuff happens on the back end.

But anyway you look at it, it's gonna be custodial.


Therein lies the rub....
nostr:nevent1qqsr8258wlul03arkjw0rlx9kkqkr3hdsdx0tnjwjmjkzef4qsz9s3cpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg9uwl86ghy6cqfukdgunjlvs4e6nvdh7gcnd5keszzastmm57dp0upsgqqqqqqsylf0z6


I think that's exactly right.
On one hand, they want to argue that fiat is a worthless arbitrary measurement system.
But on the other hand, they want to argue that somehow the equivalent fiat value increasing means something important.

Something-something Trojan horse.
When in fact ot is just an indication of regulatory capture.
or maybe incentive to regulatory capture.


This is a great question and actually opens up a whole rabbit hole.

The TLDR is
as long as the USD is the UoA, accurate pricing is impossible.


Orbit does suck if it works at all.

If you need to send other packets over Tor Invizible works good and does DNS and I2P also.


Just because they require email to sign up. Why deal with that stuff when you have options that you can do completely non-KYC.

But I don't have anything against Proton and I use their email for my KYCed public facing stuff.


yeah 😕

Until I have two or three more people on my 40
and a great Pyrenees.


Bears, bobcats, mountain lions, foxes

I'd probably have to pour a slab and make it bear proof


Small reminder, many of us late Boomers and Genx have been fighting the system. We didn't have bitcoin or any freedom Tech. Stop blaming or labeling us. The game has been broken for decades. We saw it before your birth. XOXO
ps my personal story involves 1971 and how early I got raped by the banks. Punk and DIY way before you were born.


I vote by living off grid, being as self-sufficient and paying as little taxes as possible. And of course using USD as little as possible.

Minimalism and active non-cooperation.
That's how you free a Ross. And all the other people like him.


three9 mm rounds.


Maybe a principled person would do this as a final act of clemency.
But DJT is NOT a principled person and there's no way he's going to let the Dems paint him as soft on crime.

For what, the support of a maybe 10k bitcoiners and libertarians?

Not realistic.

nostr:nevent1qqs2z5lqs7ltzlqxexwg046pj45zppu0s09umvsvwq79ed34c07fdvgpremhxue69uhkummnw3ez6ur4vgh8wetvd3hhyer9wghxuet59upzpw08v4rt5pj9dmfsrk0990zflfywwznt7g5zheap4eefgasjqg7uqvzqqqqqqyc2tcj9


I don't really get out of its contradictory to anything. I'm not talking about MY vote because I'm not fucking voting for these assholes.

Pretty sure it's *your position that's contradictory by saying that it's worth voting for this one issue, but it actually doesn't matter at all because it's already rigged anyway.

Whereas I'm just observing that socially people have problems not supporting a candidate that they've already voted for.

Which is why they make promises that they have absolutely no intention on carrying through. To get certain demographics on board.


It affects his image basically zero if a tiny group of people feel like he's been disingenuous.

There's a strange cognitive dissonance that happens. Look at his shit-coining.
He can talk to Bitcoiners and because he says, I will do this thing, everybody applauds and supports him.
And on the backside, he's shitcoins. And everybody says, oh well, it can't be helped and excuses him.

The moral of the story is, once they have your vote, it is extremely difficult to say, oh, I made a mistake and speak out loudly against the person that you've already supported.


Politicians make promises to get elected.

They don't make promises to keep them.

The only political capital to be gained by actually freeing Ross is among you and I, a tiny group of liberty-focused people.

But actually freeing him opens DJT up to a massive attack by law and order oriented  demographics which is orders of magnitude larger than ours.

So it requires a principals-oriented candidate to actually do what you're talking about, which DJT is absolutely not.


That Trump will free him.

or in fact gives a one solitary shit one way or the other, which he doesn't.


lol
DJT is not going to save you.

if fact he doesn't give a fuck about you or anyone else.


the state is violence.
if you want to stop the violence you undermine the state.

not simp for politicians making bullshit promises.
they are going to be MORE violent, not less.


if you believe this,

you're kinda an idiot.


Has it though?

or has it just achieved scalability increases at the cost of decentralization and self-custody?


for real.

I don't have enough tallow to do a deep fry.
Bacon grease?


doing @ and then typing the nick doesn't bring up a long, weirdly organized list?
you can also @ and paste the npub.

nostr:nprofile1qqsyvrp9u6p0mfur9dfdru3d853tx9mdjuhkphxuxgfwmryja7zsvhqpzamhxue69uhhv6t5daezumn0wd68yvfwvdhk6tcppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qyghwumn8ghj7mn0wd68ytnhd9hx2tcewvzaw


Sorry, I wasn't actually following your conversation.

i just got excited about donuts.


Exactly.

Their main tool prior to the implementation of Dandelion was apparently mapping transaction broadcasts to IP (since there's no deterministic way to trace txs otherwise).
But Dandelion threw a wrench in that.

But if someone connects straight to their node to broadcast obv Dandelion has no effect. So they started running their own nodes hoping to get lucky.
Which apparently happens because that's what they used in the leaked video.

Of course, if it's your node or you connect through a proxy its not a problem.

Here that vid if interested.
https://v.nostr.build/D4Nzp22vRF35IRnz.mp4


Just once I want a donut that is fried in tallow.


#facts
nostr:nevent1qqsveqpfhp74v4awz04wgqwnk2m6cs9y49ap62cvhdxeekwmtk5308spzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgsgqrs0u0vx8r8r7ad9dmvxthuajm7fm8xj7a24phcd0awpmprgkzcrqsqqqqqpmwq5dd


Oh, I would love to have ducks.

But we have a lot of predator pressure where I live... 😕


CEXs are not your friend.
therefore Monero embraces delisting.

In contrast, modern Bitcoin maxis embrace VC money and degen fiat traders. Because it pumps their bags and they can pretend that they are in it for freedom.
like spoiled children they think that "now they fight you" means price dips before they get a million USD per BTC.

The fight is just getting started and it's pretty clear the younger bitcoiners dont have the stamina for it 😟
nostr:nevent1qqsqqq9yszupykdp34jwaz99u0zumga5cl7afrwe7fmrk406fgrj20gpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsygzscm8zu6w0pwhhndfy3zeqgxxy5muu577s43j5k33y6hqztn6hmvpsgqqqqqqsyga2v7


And yet somehow it has the same purchasing power that it had 2000 years ago...

Almost like a hard cap isnt a necessary property of money...


That is exactly what they sound like.

ducks ducks ducks


Bitcoin maxis shitposting on nostr are my price alert to buy Monero


*loads up bisq*


That is incorrect.

The TLDR from the Chain Analysis Leak is:
If you're broadcasting a transaction and not connecting to your own node, connect through VPN or tour.

Even if you don't, chain analysis is learning less about your transactions than if you're using Bitcoin.


nice hedging with the

"monero has no *mainstream* adoption"
and
"monero is used on DNMs over Bitcoin"

I guess 10% of BTC transaction volume isn't real adoption ¯\_(ツ)_/¯


lol
OK bro

suggest just remaining silent when you don't know about the subject.


Mullvad and/or IVPN


name one
I'll wait


nice story bro

literally nobody said Localmonero shutting down was a good thing.

and the leaked CA video does NOT say Monero can be traced.
you just made that up.

in fact
this is all just something you made up.


gotta hit Malebranche and get a cake set 😋

there are some places in Kyoto you need a introduction to even make an order.


I mean
its alright...

tbh the radio announcer-style commentary is hard to listen to. if it was any longer I'd switch it off.


lol
you don't control that thing any more than you control your digestion and heartbeat


Build your own 👍


That's true.
*I can never understand.


Love Phoenix

could never get Zeus to work tho.
not that I tried very hard.


ecash is different. you send them SATs and they deal with all the LN stuff on the backend.

its custodial though so always the possibility they could rug you.
but better for people who just want to fuck around with small amounts on LN.


cool story bro

since you already know everything I'm out.


This is a pretty mainstream theory that's been in circulation since at the latest the 80s.

It's an accepted fact that America wanted to enter the war and was actively trying to figure out how.


I think the addition of fermented vegetables is good


Its not a good argument at all.

A single individual remaining private isn't proof of anything.
What percent of the UTXO set do you think is already KYC'd?
I think 90% is a conservative guess.


A single individual remaining unknown isn't proof of good privacy or anything else.


This is cool. Where did you get this information about summing up with bulletproofs? Thanks.


Lightning isnt good privacy.
and self - hosted email isn't a reasonable option.

Otherwise agree.


at this point im pretty sure that LN is just a settlement layer for E-cash....

nostr:nevent1qqsrsr9xk0hntgsus882utz9v22njd8mex7wvwl2dngmp6dg9hylrmqppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgs80hcy8khtjsvn2k2zsdmqd97lrsp66nhw3hn4n3m8a6zr3clqcaqrqsqqqqqpv3pr74


It isn't just lack of education though. There is a prevailing attitude in the Bitcoin community that all money will return to one, and that fucking around with anything else is a waste of time and actively counterproductive.

Just, Bitcoin is inevitable.
If we all just stack and circle jerk each other. the institutions will come in and somehow everything will just work out.

Most younger Bitcoiners seem to feel this way and become angry when you challenge it. It's the curse of a little bit of knowledge.


Pearl Harbor was almost certainly a false flag operation so that the US could change public opinion to enter the war.


plus one for AA.

In my experience, it came back to a sugar imbalance. In the short term, replacing alcohol with sweets helped, but in the long term, I had to just quit ingesting refined sugars and sweet foods.


There's also a difference between pursuing anonymity and just opting out of dragnet default surveillance.


I share information that is relevant to the discussion. You on the other hand, have never said a single thing to refute any of the information I've ever shared.

You just repeat yourself and spew ad hominems.


This is a bullshit argument. I'm sorry.

Chain analysis is mapping the entire UTXO set. Because transactions are linkable, this is possible. 90% of all UTXOs are already linked to KYC information.

Over time, the entire UTXO set will be mapped and a risk score will be assigned to each one.

Monero is designed to be gotten P2P and it does not link transactions forward and backwards. Its completely different.


and this

you have no idea what privacy guarantees you are getting with LN.
quit trying to sell it as a privacy solution.

https://i.nostr.build/KjshXTcV1l60JsJ0.jpg

https://d.nostr.build/0ua3oxgiHkycwJz8.pdf


LN doesn't offer measurable privacy. It hasn't been part of design spec until recently and its still unreliable and unquantifiable.


Except the only thing that maybe is even slightly tracking with the price action is hashrate. None of those other things have anything to do with it.


i think the credit card systems are down.
maybe pumping gas with generator power.

and yes
but all power is gasoline or diesel generated afaict


I think that's correct. The name of the game is being able to supply base load power
but still have demand response for when more people come online or go offline.


...
wut?


Just use Bitcoin for what services you can and simplify your life as much as possible.


are you still on Twitter?


Yeah
he didn't react very well to the news

nostr:nevent1qqs0phr9ksu0qyl8qx6ep0z63psv9sepshf2qgkzjp44ddr9n9303qcppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgs0npwnpyvheqz7zuvuwvv9k460c0hyqlturds40hhfn34vufvehwcrqsqqqqqpy2dxxn


I had no idea how bad it was until finding out that my friends in Asheville haven't been in contact with anyone since 7:30AM.

We suspect they are ok and we know that my best friend is out with the search and rescue crew in the area, but his wife is at home with a small baby without power and hopefully with enough supplies to make it through. But the whole area in Western NC looks awful and we have no idea how long before they can even be reached. I've tried to collect as much as I can quickly for what's going on.

Blowing Rock and Boone, NC have been hit seriously bad, we literally go there every year, its one of our favorite places in the world.

Chimney Rock has been essentially wiped out and there is still danger of the Lure Lake dam breaking, but so far it seems to have held even though the water is flowing over it. I haven't heard anything new from that and hopefully the biggest danger is past now.

My friend's parents are trapped in Black Mountain, NC (not far from Asheville) but we've gotten word from them they the road has been destroyed and they are trying to figure out how to get to my friend's wife and get out, but it seems there are no roads accessible. It's all just an asstounding mess.

A lot of these places literally have just one or two roads in and out of them, and it seems like main accesses all over the place have just been decimated. Praying for these guys.

There is a gofundme that is specifically regarding efforts in Boone for anyone who wants to donate. If you zap these posts I'll pay it forward to them if you want to use sats.

https://www.gofundme.com/f/help-support-our-group-of-five-family?attribution_id=sl:27c6e1cf-9175-47ae-8813-e9b8d62202fb&utm_campaign=man_sharesheet_ft&utm_medium=customer&utm_source=copy_link

These are images and video from Asheville:

https://v.nostr.build/rAfJzec2eIpHuVbl.mp4

https://v.nostr.build/jyZmxtbW1y1YyDhq.mp4

https://i.nostr.build/uaUY2hH46LrtFGWr.jpg

https://i.nostr.build/TR5TnJq2EsQRjaV8.jpg

https://i.nostr.build/vwXaS9ccuKAk0z8d.jpg

https://i.nostr.build/ycyYP82jx8wh8jbS.jpg

https://i.nostr.build/L5oBchZVs8lGJOY4.jpg


jitsi

easy to self host


He's suggesting that they're doxing themselves by donating.

If it was actually something that the state cared about enough to turn (more) hostile, wouldn't you want to be donating in a private fashion?

That's what Monero is for.


LOL you promoting your own personal crusade and simultaneously shitting on Monero people.


Pretty sure it's because they don't have electricity 💗


bro
losing respect for your BTC takes frankly

pick a lane

nostr:nevent1qqs0rw6qa9p2m5fpl03wlxctf3a76zyw7fejak7x4dr9y68tmlagjjsppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsvfr3f7p95stxqrjslnmuvsmhcxxxqt8swjdfjx5tz7zq0yms5cygrqsqqqqqpwpwy0l


My friend in Asheville reports that there is gasoline available
50 cars in line, cash only, one station.


the air had that nip to it this morning.

about time...


(see what I mean 😂)


you're a nice person. I've noticed.

utxo and I are not such nice people 😂


same same lol


I mean
we *would be

if he'd acknowledge any of my information
or present some of his own

but instead he just pretends nothing was said
and repeats himself a lot

kinda indefensible for a "bitcoiner" IMO


Asheville itself is blue
surrounding is red like most places


yes
but you don't have to be, if you see them as not-self


I had one friend in Aville text this morning but thats the first person in the area Ive heard from


Omg I used to live up Old Fort Rd


And you're welcome. I AM helping by talking about vulnerabilities.
You are not helping because you're trying to sell a beta solution as already finished.

Bitcoin became what it is today because of thinking critically and adversarily.
You are actively working against that.


Yes, this paper documents ways of tracking information about lightning translations, presented last week by two researchers at a university in Dresden.

Lightning is not a privacy solution. It is not stress-tested and anybody trying to sell it as a solution for Bitcoin privacy is either ignorant or intellectually dishonest.


but otherwise
that's cool man

I'm happy people are using the tools.

because I'm not a maxi zealot.


You, and probably nobody else either, have any idea how private LN is or not.

your lack intellectual honesty for a supposed bitcoiner is frightening.
https://d.nostr.build/0ua3oxgiHkycwJz8.pdf


prove it.
anyone can post shit on the Internet.


moneros tx volume is usually less than 10% BTCs so this is certainly true 👍

probably a higher % of XMR txs are MoA type txs but BTC absolutely has more total txs


find me a monero bro who is talking about price.
like, at all...


I called him out over selling LN as a privacy solution and then this paper came out. so of course its monero bros who are salty.
https://i.nostr.build/U2hN7yPN4X7mztco.jpg


"i was standing in line at the coffee shop and there was this monero bro" 😂

how's LN privacy coming along?


It's not a people-having-guns problem.

It's a people-wanting-to-kill-other-people problem.


You can't be my friend if you want to talk on Telegram


Old Isaac was a pretty cool guy.

nostr:nevent1qqsgcczhsjzhsz58hqf8c725mswua3ua4vclgc7v5s79exarzjhnr9spzemhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumt0wd68ytnsw43z7q3q2xwjlv7r2n6y7h2v0n0u2vnr8khs9x7v042tavxtpamsv3hcx58sxpqqqqqqz0k35t0


Definitely. With a little squeeze of lemon? 👍


Bull bitcoin?

although that guy is an asshole


I expect they'll get around to it eventually.

Coinbase is bad bro.


What happens when you try?

Both of those are obviously centralized custodial services that could deny your transfer for whatever reason they want.


Holy shit, is chimney rock really gone?


The worst kind of bad actor isn't actually the outright scammer.

The worst kind of bad actor is the one that knows a little bit but aggressively asserts their view as if it was legitimate and well thought put.
When encountering any kind of counterfactual, they just sort of pretend like it doesn't exist, or that maybe they never said anything in the first place.

They don't have any sort of allegiance to facts in the end and are uninterested in actually refining an accurate perspective.
So they aggressively assert lies and half truths, laugh it off when they're shown to be incorrect, only to repeat them again as if they were legit views.

Don't be that guy.

nostr:nevent1qqspk7stpxknjn9latm5e96nmmgqsdp5gj3hztg2wvwpzkxtwvuxwqspzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36crqsqqqqqpp08sqp


this guy gets it
nostr:nevent1qqs8spwgztr0tr2l0nxltuqtkysq67cf6fdm4d7j8c9g795rg0myqgsppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgs238xfxyh395snmlhpx9ts9set77y8p5vupk0hp5yq9xfrmxkca9crqsqqqqqpucjevr


safe 👍


If we had figured out nuclear in the 70s we would have flying cars and jet packs

its another "wtf happened in 1971” thing


I basically don't trust anything I read about it.
But it makes sense to me to transition away from fossil fuels anyway.


they probably killed bankers too

proper social reinforcement is key


Long Ago in China being a public servant meant high social prestige,
but relative financial poverty.
To use your position for personal gain meant social ostracism if you were discovered.

We should bring back these social values.


lol this guy Erik is a huge fan of small thorium liquid-salt cooled reactors


I highly recommend this series if you're interested in the subject.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC613iBZ6bzD5T58pWzurQ3g


So it isn't open source (using precompiled libraries that don't )exist anywhere else
but you plan to use it anyway?

explain please.


The publishers of the paper are from the Technical University of Dresden.

Florian Tschorsch is an assistant professor.
"In his research, he strives for the integration of security and privacy aspects in distributed system architectures and networking protocols"
https://www.tu.berlin/en/dsi/team/florian-tschorsch

Charmaine Ndolo is a PhD student of his.
"My main research themes are the performance, security and resilience of blockchain-based P2P networks such as the Lightning network."
https://cndolo.github.io/

clearly bad actors just bent on spreading FUD and undermining faith in the extremely secure and private LN protocol.

right nostr:nprofile1qqszrqlfgavys8g0zf8mmy79dn92ghn723wwawx49py0nqjn7jtmjagpz9mhxue69uhkummnw3ezuamfdejj7q6rek8 nostr:nprofile1qqsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36cpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuat50phjummwv5hszymhwden5te0wahhgtn4w3ux7tn0dejj7qg4waehxw309an8yetwwvh82arcduhx7mn99uuwx66a


we can see all the NSFW hashtags you follow too

nostr:nevent1qqstuqfhugu0xm805g56cs5tmkftdajq7gualgqn7scyh3k9ztt5khsppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgstssvle5fz69tecurs282n9hkc6qadcudwg4yhtr5nuqt2nmjnqtsrqsqqqqqps3pcdh


Of course, signal can see who you're messaging in that case.
Hiding metadata turns out to be very difficult.


Because over time total productivity increases and the nominal cost of production falls. So you're always in the position of representing the value of *more stuff with the same quantity of money.
You end up disincentivizing economic activity because it's better to hold your money unless you have some surefire get rich scheme.

In other words, a little supply inflation is good acchually.


Why do you think they might not hold it if they understood it?


Do you know if this uses COMIT for Bitcoin to Monero swaps?


Furthermore, I'm saying that having a hard cap is not a necessary, even desirable, condition of hard money.


I'm not trying to make the case that gold is better money. I'm just saying that it didn't fail because it has supply inflation.


OK I think I see the clarification you are making.

doesnt having the non-inflating currency denominated in an inflating one make things EXTREMELY "not equal"?
by which I mean accurate pricing of everything (including the non-inflating currency) becomes difficult if not impossible.

which is why I'm making a case that a non-inflating currency should be UOA.

and that its important for bitcoiners to recognize that pricing is all kinds of fucked.


Someone created a thread on X and the TLDR is, that, still, part of the code is missing and since we can't compare it fully, so : don't verify, trust...

Lol

https://xcancel.com/ottosch_/status/1840185592602071082?s=19


Of course, it's likely that the price of gold is being artificially suppressed and it should be two or three times higher than it is right now.


Monero has a lower inflation rate than gold. As is famous, gold still has the same purchasing power than it had 2000 years ago.

A hard cap is a stupid knee-jerk reaction to fiat insanity. Understandable, but ultimately poor monetary policy.


It matters because you have a stable yardstick by which to measure other things.
When your UOA can be arbitrarily created, what does it mean to price something in it?


What's a "stable currency" if the underlying UOA is fiat without a consistent monetary policy?

Maybe I don't understand the point you're making.


there's no such thing as infinite time except as a mathematical abstraction.

A correct statement would be
"as time *approaches* infinity, the supply also *approaches* infinity."
maxis leave the first part out.

As I said, having a consistent tail emission isn't a problem for anybody in the present
or for anybody's descendants in the future.


whatever you like bro

that has nothing to do with the point i was making.


omg he's beautiful


it matters because people who don't know any better will try to argue that this is a BTC denominated chart.

It isn't.
Its a chart of the relative USD-denominated price.

UoA is sneaky and has to be pulled out by the roots.

nostr:nevent1qqsyd8787gk0tu6kh697pl5ty7xr6ckpwegzqrspkg87xvqypnyfu3cpr9mhxue69uhkvmpwwp6hyurvv4ex2mrp0yhxxmmd9upzp30pwducmtffm54cqc4cxyyhftks5uhrv30eukxjz2dud273tk9lqvzqqqqqqymggcvk


it isn't correct that its only a semantic difference.

prices only fall from your perspective because USD (the *actual* UoA) is piling into bitcoin faster than inflation and the other forces that devalue it.

it matters because that's what "the price" is measured in, which is the definition of UoA. doing some division in your head doesn't change that.

the objective of course is to have things measured in BTC. but measuring in BTC has no meaning as long as BTC itself is measured in USD.

because as long as prices are measured in USD,
when it comes down to it
you are still measuring in USD.

even if you convert to the relative value in sats.


totally


Because the price of Bitcoin is still measured in USD, even if you convert it into BTC, your unit of account is still the US dollar.

It isn't UOA until prices are denominated in BTC.


bitcoiners dont know what "unit of account" means.

it does NOT mean "convert the USD price into BTC"

nostr:nevent1qqsr5hy4x627x6lugv35gtjnxhsxrd37ytsdhd4lsh4acv6tyquq09gppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgstm84k2lp9knmvmf5gw88zvfvar7duvfpqfplryfystdn55ug2gksrqsqqqqqp0hxcwd


totally.
those will last a lifetime

I have a set of chisels that are 🤌


The red and white handled ones are my favorite


When any individual
living now or in the future,
can know *exactly* how much Monero is in circulation at any point during their life,

how is the supply "infinite?"

nostr:nevent1qqsw2mv9c9k3zws56835twpewhghudxpyghj9vypv8yllqlefun8dlqppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsyk5ma0yzmtq87n99q9299smvc3kxu0rvu5479ng9ejc455ud6jdqrqsqqqqqplmau37


The monero supply is only infinite if you have infinite time. At the moment it is more scarce than Bitcoin.

Unchanging monetary policy is what is important. And both Bitcoin and Monero have that.

Besides, a hard cap is stupid. It makes cool memes aand that's about all you can say in its favor.


Why use XMPP when there's Simplex?
or just Signal if you dont care about metadata.


"why Japanese people"


with one damn cherry tomato
SMH


lol
Japanese salads are not salads.


I literally just did, but you're either too stupid to understand or too lazy to use your brain.

But since I am exceedingly generous...

All pairs are measures of relative speculative investment. Period.
ETH has found a way to sell their narrative and draw investors. Everybody knows this.
If you're surprised, you haven't been paying attention.

XMR, on the other hand, deliberately antagonizes institutional investors and cheers de-listing from CEX's.
So it surprises absolutely nobody that VC capital won't touch it.

Okay, now run along, son. You bother me.


wut?


Show your work loser. Centralized how?


for the record,
this is what intellectual honesty looks like.

nostr:nevent1qqsg9zs53kcmkh3t5uxjlvv8nk7x0z74u8vq5xh60yu6fyjpczq3sncpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0qgs2umd2ht73w8vewc9pqa98jk4cv2k9vxjkpy97svrtawew9vrjt0crqsqqqqqpu3wgp0


I'm happy UTXOs trolling actually produced some agreement 😂


There are legitimate criticisms to make about the trade-offs that Monero uses.

You just don't know what they are.

I suggest keeping your mouth shut until you know a little more.


I appreciate your intellectual honesty.

In fact, there's nothing shitty about Monero. It just simply is not Bitcoin.


imma say it again.

There are no BTC-denominated charts.

Look
Any currency pair or commodity pair are graphs of the underlying relative USD value of each commodity.
This is because if they diverge, it's trivial for traders to jump in and make free fiat trading the pair. So that action forces the currency pair or commodity pair towards the mean relative fiat value.

In other words, if the pair changes without an underlying change in USD price, I buy one commodity, flip to the other one and sell. Free fiat.

There are about a million people with alerts on their phones waiting for this sort of action to happen so they can do exactly this trade.

You cannot get away from USD while it is still unit of account. All these charts are graphs of relative USD-denominated value.

It's really ironic and sad that bitoiners don't understand this basic fact.


And you're just a kid who doesn't know what he's talking about yet.

Look
Any currency pair or commodity pair are graphs of the underlying relative USD value of each commodity.
This is because if they diverge, it's trivial for traders to jump in and make free fiat trading the pair. So that action forces the currency pair or commodity pair towards the mean relative fiat value.

In other words, if the pair changes without an underlying change in USD price, I buy one commodity, flip to the other one and sell. Free fiat.

There are about a million people with alerts on their phones waiting for this sort of action to happen so they can do exactly this trade.

You cannot get away from USD while it is still unit of account. All these charts are graphs of relative USD-denominated value.


the chart is a graph of the function:
(XMR/USD)/(BTC/USD)

keep working son, you'll get there. We're all rooting for you.


a bunch of VC money and fiat degens piling into bitcoin doesn't make its "value" increase
except in the most trivial fiat fashion.

fiat price increase != value

congratulations, youre a fiat maxi.


came to talk to yourself huh?
cause this is just a non sequitur.

nobody said any of that.


+1 for bitwarden

but I don't know a lot of options because BW always just worked


"durr its measured in BTC man. it says right on the graph durrrr"


it isn't a matter of anyone's fucking opinion.

we are looking at THESE charts.
THESE charts are measuring in USD.


sorry misread your response to utxo.

you're absolutely right than most people will never use LN in a self sovereign way. they will opt for custodial,nonprivate solutions.

that wont keep these religious fanatics from claiming they've solved Bitcoin privacy because there's this thing that will be implemented soon™ that works for some people some of the time.


yeah thats a link to MY nostr.build homie. I'm paying for that hosting.

what's your point?


obviously not someone with a need for strong privacy.

if you want to actually learn something
(and not just repeat soundbites)
the leaked Chainanal video is here.
Good info about general CA techniques in the 1st half.

tldr
you can even use CA run nodes if you connect through a proxy (VPN or tor).
monero offers strong *default* privacy guarantees with a good UX, stable monetary policy and commitment to the cypherpunk ethos.

https://v.nostr.build/D4Nzp22vRF35IRnz.mp4


The VCs are in Bitcoin dude
not Monero, which is delisted from most major exchanges.

and there is no founder premine.

maybe learn something before you run your mouth.


really grateful for nostr:nprofile1qqsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36cpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuat50phjummwv5hszymhwden5te0wahhgtn4w3ux7tn0dejj7qg4waehxw309an8yetwwvh82arcduhx7mn99uuwx66a for once again giving me the opportunity to help clear up common misunderstandings about what "value" is and what these charts are actually measuring.

nostr:nevent1qqsguysg0njjfmsaug8ukasxtddzvp9tt8xgfeax594f4zldx2wty6spr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36crqsqqqqqpgwttje


there are no Bitcoin denominated charts.

try again.


US dollars are not a measurement of "value"

I mean
like 90% of the time you agree with that statement.
except when it fits your narrative to argue the opposite way of course.


tell me you're a closet fiat maxi without telling me...

USD is either an arbitrary capricious thing to measure with
or it isn't.

you can't have it both ways when it suits you.


The absurdity of claiming that L.N. is already a privacy solution when bolt12 offers only have optional blinded paths shows that they don't understand anonsets.

The people promoting these tools are not the people that have real need for default privacy. They are simply religious fanatics and don't care about the facts.


90% of people saying "holding value" are actually talking about increase in fiat net worth.

Fiat price is not an irrelevant metric but it doesn't mean what most people think it means.
And simply that it's a fiat metric means that Bitcoiners in particular should take it with a grain of salt.


frankly its ridiculous to talk about an asset as young as Bitcoin "holding value"

what you're seeing is VC money and institutions speculating on a new asset class. which is the only reason bitcoin is priced as it is in fiat terms.

that isn't "holding value." that's speculative interest by fiat hodlers.


so you want to connect a round post to a poured slab?


lol
another maxi limping along on three brain cells


LP is awesome

but its a big difference from an iPhone.

i loved mine but itn wasnt rugged enough for my lifestyle


Doesn't JP want to Kyc social media users to get rid of trolls?

ngmi


At this point I'm pretty sure you're one of my ex-girlfriends.


You mean on top of a footer or exactly how?
Is the concrete already poured or not?


It reeks of desperation and defensiveness.

monero is literally just helping people make private ccensorship resistant transactions. and has been for years

whereas y'all are desperate to get people to use beta software that has NOT been tested in the wild.
because it fits your internal narrative better.

sad.


good PoW privacy on L1.


you don't know what you're talking about.

what struggle?


the desperation is palpable.
like, what exactly are they so afraid of??

just being wrong i guess...
nostr:nevent1qqsy6lgmpxlkar4cw8ppeucvwyxt3m26grvj57wrvtv4wqcsh3k7tdqppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsw9n8heusyq0el9f99tveg7r0rhcu9tznatuekxt764m78ymqu36crqsqqqqqp5mu4cp


you have no idea if thats true or not because the network hasn't been stress tested at all yet.
maxis have been saying the same shit for fucking years.

the way it works is:
build the tech
implement the tech
try and break the tech
fix the tech
(repeat ad infinitum)

THEN maybe you have a real privacy solution.

quit trying to claim victory at step 1 and 2, you look desperate.


ayoooo
nuance?!

omfg


do your yoga boys and girls

it's easoer to maintain what you got,
than it is to get it back once you slack off and lose it


I'm aware it sometimes works and that's great.
occasional functionality isn't "solving receiver privacy."

but it is promising.


Not really.

the technical problems of drilling down through hot rock remain unsolved.
Erik Townsend has some interesting videos about this.


Bolt 12 basically only works in laboratory conditions

taproot has no privacy gains on it's own except to make multisig spends look indistinguishable from single Sig (and how many addresses are taproot enabled these days, 10%)

this is just the same "strong privacy is coming to bitcoin" line maxis have been saying forever.
AT LEAST the last 6 years.

coming soon ™


You're talents are proclaimed far and wide sir


they're different but basically the same

mibuna doesn't have the jagged edges.


lol the AI wannabe kanji


can't prove a negative...

prove to me something *doesn't exist.


Hey nostr:nprofile1qqs827g8dkd07zjvlhh60csytujgd3l9mz7x807xk3fewge7rwlukxgpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhszrnhwden5te0dehhxtnvdakz7qgswaehxw309ahx7um5wghx6mmd9usjfpck
any idea why Obtainium doesn't want to update Amber-offline past 1.3.7?

it doesn't provide any other info, just "conflict"


dont we all


FYI there are some questions about whether all the libs are open source.
Laurent appears to be taking the lead on this.

https://gist.github.com/LaurentMT/891bc518bc94cc549e6af25647d66a4d


LaurentMTs (OXT dev) gist about the  verification of the Ashigaru wallet codebase

so far so good.

https://gist.github.com/LaurentMT/891bc518bc94cc549e6af25647d66a4d


I use both and there's no reason to use anything else 👍


I used to wrap a frozen pet bottle in a towel and sleep with it between my legs in the summer  (≧▽≦)


I eat vegetables if they're fermented.
in nuka for example.

but otherwise same, beef bacon and eggs.


makes visiting very fun.

but entertaining Japanese visitors difficult 😂


higher resolution plz sir


Japan has the best vegetables.
Best beef too actually

best food...? maybe.


oooohh shit
this might get me.

but fr yo
that typo in your last email was wack
(50% != $50)


mibuna > komatsuna


unclear what the service or app is you are offering


蒸し熱いでしょう


courtesy of Bitcoin Q&A

https://gist.github.com/LaurentMT/891bc518bc94cc549e6af25647d66a4d


Your welcome.

6s and 7s are good too
the main difference IMO is that the 8 is guaranteed to get updates for another 6 years.

but if you think you'll want a new phone in the next 2-3 yrs it doesn't matter.


If you want a secure private phone there's no second best to a pixel with Graphene installed.

I got a Pixel 8 a month ago and I love it.


correct.

but the question i believed was "is a G account necessary to use Android apps"

it isn't.
although Play Services is needed for lots of app notifications.


spicy take 🌶

"stay humble and stack sats"
is only valid if you have faith in the inevitability success of Bitcoin as freedom money.

but if the trajectory is instead towards regulatory capture it's bad advice.

(maybe still good advice if you're just interested in fiat buying power)


you dont need it for Graphene.


I don't even have Google Play Services installed on my Graphene.
you don't really need it except for some apps notifications.

a rather technical explanation here
https://grapheneos.org/features#sandboxed-google-play


I don't even have Gplay store installed on my Pixel.


also
this data about Ashigaru is important

nostr:nevent1qqs87n9hamk4vwsadusmylajh3kk7nqxrr4325zg76edst6vhk9mj8qpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8eshfsjxtusp0pwxw8xxzm2a8u8mjq047pkc2hmm5ec6kwykvmhvpsgqqqqqqs89aunx


Hey nostr:nprofile1qqs0sxxdz722j74u5kvzym4chlualjx0jef32llvdveg98jpqs0tmlgpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0amkmxc

FYI you fatfingered the Chapters for the last Brief. Wrote the last chapter starts at 1:28:00 but pod is only 1:23:30.

Love the pod.
Have pretty much given up on RHR since its just nostr and LN simping without any real privacy content 🙏


I put it on nostr[.]build

nostr:nevent1qqswrnwg8yvtvnpucchfn4mdkf0vq39kkka5l68hgw3auulzwfuygagprdmhxue69uhhyetvv9ujumn0wd68ymmrddjhgtn0wfnj7q3qlxzaxzge0jq9u9cecucctdt5lslwgp7hcxmp2l0wn8r2ecjenwasxpqqqqqqzwwcnax


https://v.nostr.build/D4Nzp22vRF35IRnz.mp4

👍


Hey nostr:nprofile1qqs0sxxdz722j74u5kvzym4chlualjx0jef32llvdveg98jpqs0tmlgpzdmhxue69uhhwmm59e6hg7r09ehkuef0amkmxc

DYI you fatfingered the Chapters for the last Brief. Wrote the last chapter starts at 1:28:00 but pod is only 1:23:30.

Love the pod.
Have pretty much given up on RHR since its just nostr and LN simping without any real privacy content 🙏