Oddbean

First, they came for the Inscriptors and I didn't speak out. Then, they came for the Ordinal Enjoooyers and I didn't speak out. Next, they came for the Whirlpoolers and I didn't speak out. Where do we draw the line with censorship? nostr:note1nrn98rkc89sk5ysmz4cvcqu8mv6twzeuyykg7cuufl3700vgs2zqmefn2z

Analogy is spot on. What does it matter what they choose to put in a block? Let the other miners put in what they want. If they get big and people don't like it hopefully more pools that decentralize mining pop up like OCEAN and they put what they want in their blocks. Not really understanding the hate against what they are doing if you are truly for a stronger bitcoin with decentralized mining.

You realize you have 2 options. Better competing product or convince enough people that it’s censorship and not free market choice to do so. And do so in a way that doesn’t use personal attacks as we have seen from others in the past

Based on discussion about it and not actually having looked at the code yet, it gives more control to the individual, something you should be for given your values. If the premise is true, that an individual nodes carry limit can be ignored, this is forced association. The size can also be adjusted back to the larger, inscription accepting size. Basing my conclusion on this: nostr:nevent1qqs2fpcdf0f73vypysyeywhrpdnek0sqxstprhvcvl0dtpwmf84xxvspz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsyg8a6h50dtsdhqtmuzm3mgsynrqcq6tgmznyt92ecfylxgh6wdry5upsgqqqqqqstupe6q

There's no "let it happen" or "don't let it happen" in Bitcoin. Luke can do what he wants with the blocks his pool mines, and anyone who disagrees with him won't mine on his pool. As long as there is a substantial amount of miners willing to include Ordinals in blocks, then there is no way to ACTUALLY censor them. So far, it is looking like that will be the case for the foreseeable future, since OCEAN is the only option for taking a firm stance against including Ordinals and yet they haven't attracted even 1% of the hashrate. It's the same thing with OFAC sanctioned transactions. As long as there's a substantial amount of hashrate out there that won't exclude them, they will make it into a block.

Choosing not to use open source is still a choice made in the free market. Forcing everyone to only use open source is not freedom. Is it a bad choice ? In most cases yes, terrible. In some niche cases, without me approving of OCEAN, it makes sense. Like in house softwate for a competitive business. I'm not sure i want my national electricity regulation software to be open source...

I want those who build it to learn from open source, but to open source it is to invite a bug with the type of failure that ends nations. There are alternative ways to build resilient software. Domain appropriateness.

Which nation has been ended by a foss bug? Sounds too dramatic. All centralized systems are single points of failure. Resilience imo can only be achieved by decentralization, especially for crucial infra. What is the point of a national electricity regulation software except for government crooks to abuse it, errrr sorry, "for it to be hacked by chAina"?

It's funny, i'm a militant Foss, but i can't even begin to imagine how open sourcing electricity management software on github would even start. Imagine the PR's from hostile nations. There are ways to do it, in a way where the OS community improves the grid while reducing hostile risk. But just a regular open source realease cycle ? How ? There are also legacy concerns. The system is itself subject to inter agency norms, generational release cycles, local political concerns. Its not running on a singular software base, like ASOP, software projects, or more recent monolithic power grid projects like Mexico, african countries, ect. Each state has had its own home grown , often incompatible ecosystem, since the invention of electricity. This is a good thing. There are several things you want air gapped and in house. Your wife, your money and the national fucking power grid software. Seems obvious. Imagine a library fault upstream the way nodejs spazzes out every few years. Except its grannies dying in winter. open to better ways of thinking about it though

Yikes dude. Ocean is a participant, knots is the software. Many people run old versions of Bitcoin, are they all censoring because their node doesn't validate any segwit data? Nobody is coming for anyone, releasing competing versions is healthy for the ecosystem and the network, which is hard for monero folks to wrap their heads around, blindly following every hard fork. If you don't like knots you are free not to use it or mine with ocean. Let the free market work.

Running an outdated node doesn’t affect what gets included in blocks. I was talking about Ocean, not Knots, Knots is a joke as Luke Dash Jr has 100% control and merges whatever he sees fit directly into main lol I can both think the free market is the ultimate judge and bring attention to this to our social pressure on them and be sure miners know what they’re getting into when they mine with Ocean. On the plus side at least Ocean is being transparent about their censorship now!

All good points, but they apply just as much to Monero hard forks If you don't like Monero you are free not to use it, you can fork it, or opt out by swapping your existing Monero. Let the free market work. Incompatibilities exists here just like they would in any free market.

He who mines the block can choose which txns to include and exclude. Everything is an attack on bitcoin if you ask the right person. No one is entitled to block-space. Best we can do is economically incentivize block producers to sell us some block space for our txns. They are under no moral obligation to include any txn however

There is currently a discount rate for certain types of data, so this is only partially true. Enabling better spam filtering and making it harder for arbitrary data to outbid higher value transactions make Bitcoin better.

For being an "attack on Bitcoin" it's a pretty pathetic one. They haven't found a block since the 3rd of the month, and no one can point to a single transaction that was effectively censored (was never confirmed into a block) due to their actions. Point your hashrate elsewhere and get on with your life. nostr:note1k4765svkcg0qgzrea208qcp98vhj80gph62a6e4hr9pnhz3clhmsrkmla5

I found another pleb discussing and commenting on the "censorship" controversy... Worth reading: nostr:nevent1qqstjqm0lc0jpesnzun0w8qxxml2e9aykfppferknr7fh4qd2wmsrsqpz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfdupzpde8f55w86vrhaeqmd955y4rraw8aunzxgxstsj7eyzgntyev2xtqvzqqqqqqyg25lp9 nostr:nevent1qqswu20syrl3yxft3ylftnxn3uj8vpe5gnsja8zg9k96zseqr090xwspz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfdupzpde8f55w86vrhaeqmd955y4rraw8aunzxgxstsj7eyzgntyev2xtqvzqqqqqqy8lmlmn nostr:nevent1qqsw7k0jh299046ny0ulzgspnh950zzzqsvmqdwfe57hkxxevwpr2hcpz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfdupzpde8f55w86vrhaeqmd955y4rraw8aunzxgxstsj7eyzgntyev2xtqvzqqqqqqysadvpw nostr:nevent1qqs8wzd3nzdr9wxfys6z7gg2es4djy7h7qj4asefsuzdjw5ptu3mnhspz3mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfdupzpde8f55w86vrhaeqmd955y4rraw8aunzxgxstsj7eyzgntyev2xtqvzqqqqqqy2yfpl2