Oddbean new post about login | logout @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: definitely cant justify the fancy machine right now but some time later if i still need a lot of rings. wish i knew someone with a dremel i could borrow but dont really wanna buy something to find out it doesnt work for what i want
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: i think a dremel will be slower than bolt cutters, but less effort, and cleaner cuts how thick is your wire? pro quality dremel or air powered die grinder (something that can use a 1/4 inch collet or an adjustable chuck) should be able to zip through them pretty fast i think my best suggestion for you is get a good flex shaft dremel for about $1-200, and put a HSS slitting saw on it (harbor freight or amazon) https://www.amazon.com/LDEXIN-Slitting-Slotting-Cutting-Thickness/dp/B07J4ZSYYL
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: thickest wire i will use is 12 gauge but mostly 15 or 16 gauge
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: should be no prob for a dremel with a saw you should be able to squish the ring a bit and maintain a round shape with a 0.5mm cut
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: no ive tested with my rings and anything over .3 doesnt really give a perfect closure and it bothers me
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: if you use a plier with a curved jaw that puts even pressure around the entire ring it should work- or give it an additional squish on the opposite axis. flat piers might give an oval shape
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: you shimmy the ring "arms" back and forth until its closed, i dont think the shape of the plier rly matters. when the gap is too wide, your choice is an oval ring or a closure with a bit of a v-shape to it. the ideal ring has no gap at all and clicks shut instead of having to shimmy it. i saw a guy on youtube say he gets his rings to do this by baking them in an oven at high heat for half an hour so they "relax" and expand a bit but i havent been able to replicate it
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: stainless is pretty brittle and can work harden when bending so it is going to have some spring back. annealing in an oven or with a torch would help. if the oven doesn't get hot enough, just hit it with a propane torch til it turns a straw yellow color it's tempting for me to try this out with some stainless tig filler rods, but too many projects now
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: i cant really try this with a torch or annealing oven, the guy literally said 270c iirc so i tried it in a kitchen oven. i dont have a safe area to use a torch in but i totally want to set up one someday
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: for propane torch use all you need is a few fire bricks from the hardware store
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: i dont have a well ventilated room to work in, doesnt heating metal produce fumes?
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: not much fumes. the torch itself, and the steel won't make any fumes at that temp. the fire brick may. just a window and a fan should take care of it
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: hmm maybe i will try it :apuhmm:
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: the problem squishing stainless rings into a nice circle does sound like spring back and annealing should help with that
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: doesnt annealing require cooling down very slowly though? or else it actually hardens? how do you control that with a torch
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: depends on the steel. to fully anneal you can heat them to a cherry red and cover them with sand to cool slowly you may have to buff them after that
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 I use vermiculite from the garden center for annealing. Very cheap and much easier to move around than a 5 gallon bucket of sand.
@Hypnotize Feminists @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: i will check for that if i try it, ty. my bf is giving me a hard no on a torch though 🥀
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @Hypnotize Feminists a mini propane torch (like for soldering) is not very dangerous. just dont leave it unattended and wear gloves. you can also use it outside
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 heck, since her rings are so small do you think holding them over a candle for a while would do the trick? It also occurs to me that with them being such a small size that annealing might be difficult because they'll still lose heat so quickly, even packed in vermiculite or sand.
@Hypnotize Feminists @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: im assuming theres a proper tool to do it like a temperature controlled furnace where you can specify the cooling rate. i wonder what blacksmiths use
@67975218 @Hypnotize Feminists yea ofc :akko_wink: furnaces and forges. electric furnaces are expensive tho
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists theyre also really huge from brief googling
@67975218 @Hypnotize Feminists you can get bench top models that aren't exactly huge, but they are probably going to cost at least $500 and probably over $1k for anything decent yea just try a candle or somehow convince bf that it's not a big deal. set up a fireproof work area. maybe not a great idea on carpet.
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists i can probaby get a torch eventually. i was thinking maybe the dremel versaflame looking at the local store. but idk i will take some time to think about it
@67975218 @Hypnotize Feminists that looks cool but also looks like you'll be buying proprietary gas cylinders. a plain old plumbing torch is a little bigger and cheaper and would probably work better for what you're doing
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists this is literally the only other type of torch i can find on local websites, does this look right? most say culinary use. sry im clueless https://niscii.xyz/files/9a16fcfe-23f8-4528-bbf8-8d124a7dee70
@67975218 @d3a4f43e @Hypnotize Feminists Not sure a creme brulee torch is gonna do the job. lol. Maybe tho?
@542debdc @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists this one says good for soldering and creme brulee lol. im trying to find other types and failing
@67975218 @542debdc @Hypnotize Feminists ah cool. you want something like this i think https://www.bernzomatic.com/Products/Hand-Torches way bigger gas cylinder. those little butane cylinders are gona run out fast
@67975218 @Hypnotize Feminists @542debdc i would get this. like $20 https://www.bernzomatic.com/Products/Hand-Torches/Manual-Ignition/WK2201
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists @542debdc legitimately cant find anything that looks like this here at least online. i'll ask around, ty
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @542debdc maybe most places won't want to ship pressurized cylinders? You can find them at any hardware store, they're rather ubiquitous.
@Hypnotize Feminists @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @542debdc no i mean the hardware stores have online fronts that just list their instore stock and i cant find a listing for anything like it at all. but i will ask when i go next
@542debdc @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists i mean if you can do it with a candle maybe lol
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists mobsters who run italian restaurants as fronts bulk order these and use them to torture people in basements
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists oh it says it can be refilled with any butane canister i think
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: btw sorry if I missed it but what are you making with tiny rings?
@Hypnotize Feminists @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: im currently learning to make chainmail. just working with aluminium right now but if i keep doing it and not just get bored of it i'd like to make it out of steel https://files.niscii.xyz/obj/3131e7cf-f8cc-44a3-9d8b-8ab8813d9d93.webp
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: that's incredible! I'd love to learn more about armor. Holland Anvil had an armorer's swage block for sale now so that's piqued my interest.
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists @67975218 depends on how hot you want to go https://hackaday.com/2019/03/10/diy-reflow-oven-is-heavily-documented/
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: there are tables you can look up to determine what temperature a metal should be at and for how long, but when I need to anneal something I've forged I just eyeball it at a cherry red or dull orange and then put it directly in the vermiculite. It works for what I do. Although when I anneal stuff I try to do it in batches so they'll keep it hotter for longer.
@Hypnotize Feminists @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 stainless wire strain hardens a little when being wrapped around a mandrel, or bent into shape. just heating it up is going to relieve most of that stress. sure, a candle could work. it is possible to get wire red hot over a candle only some kinds of steel air harden- like A2 tool steel. i dont believe common stainless like 316 will air harden much so it's proably not necessary to cover them
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 ah okay, I know next to nothing about stainless steels. I do have some a2 in stock but never messed with it before. Just trying to think of a work around since she's not able to have a torch.
@Hypnotize Feminists @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 candle is a good suggestion i have used A2 before. it really does air harden which is kind of weird to me. i'm assuming you would have to cover that stuff to anneal it
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: @67975218 I ran across some ⅜" round bar from a junkyard which I assumed was mild steel and brought home about 5 sticks thinking it would make excellent stock for hooks, but it air hardens so much that I can't drill it even after forging and annealing. I think the proper way to anneal air hardening steels in a controlled manner over the course of many hours.
@Hypnotize Feminists that sounds like an air hardening tool steel to me. it didn't anneal even with vermiculite (or sand?)
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: no, I annealed in vermiculite hoping it would be easier to drill, but it had no effect. I got it from a scrap yard that has an assortment of dimensional stock from project overages, so presumably it's all mild steel or at most a36. This was in a pile of about 100 sticks.
@Hypnotize Feminists vermiculite has a fair amount of air vs sand? you may need to do it in a more controlled ramp with a furnace i was able to temper A2 to a blue color and it worked when i was making a tool. can't recall exactly what the project was off hand
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: yes I believe so. The particles are almost the size of kitty litter but they have the weight of styrofoam, so very low density. That being said, if I put in a piece of iron it's still too hot to touch nearly 6 hours later, so the insulation value is excellent. https://media.clubcyberia.co/pleroma/e80759ce7ca114fa53719574bb7e98d27a6df8e0cdaa2c832cfc103083e0b587.jpg
@Hypnotize Feminists good to know
@Hypnotize Feminists @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @67975218 or get yourself a fisher burner. could even fasten it to a surface if you were worried about tipping it over Zxn5z5.jpg https://bae.st/media/b7ae42ec797b699efcc3421851543068bc148d867309815bf5870ba7320c2884.jpg?name=Zxn5z5.jpg
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: out of curiosity i decided to try with stainless welding rod ~1mm. so the answer is yes, dremel with abrasive wheel works ok, (at least this looks fine to me) no annealing required* *with the caveat that you squish the gap and then fix the oval shape by turning 90 degrees and squishing again before closing https://fluf.club/media/975dcb66ca430348fbe5feaa2ecd797cfcf2f712f9b757773b65bdb045aa1575.jpg https://fluf.club/media/7c06be2564999b4f4114d02b414d8a8a2b2f22c6e81948637e7f9a14afa8fdfe.jpg https://fluf.club/media/0784f8b283e0021e934468db26ff2c1694eb784b93376bc50520114266b7a0bb.jpg https://fluf.club/media/ee6e23195e9eb5c7156b99d2d2ac07e910cdfbae476cca1190a5affca2080ca9.jpg
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: i used these grooves in the channel lock pliers to squish, then 2 needle nose pliers to close the ring https://fluf.club/media/b34094a2e80c646f810d2eaf3c8b603ee06e206a25f84b4ff3996e5e3d2ee588.jpg
@67975218 @roboneko@bae.s ~1mm disc https://fluf.club/media/20ec1e520e06a559569211fc16a55c1fae040fee2253414216ae91d0ece3ff44.jpg
@67975218 ps holding them in a vice they do tend to grab the wheel and go flying. i think a mandrel would be better
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: yea i imagined they would lol
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: could use a sacrificial bamboo knitting needle
@67975218 yea, i just wanted to test the idea. holding the rings securely while cutting, and using a thinner disc ( i do have some much thinner ones, i just used what i had handy), and annealing would all make it come out rounder i think
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: it definitely turned out better than i expected with the 1mm disc. i might try the dremel route and just get the thinnest discs i can find :blobcat: google really wants me to look at aliexpress cutting discs. im not sure thats a good idea
@67975218 thinnest abrasive discs i have are 0.6mm. no fiber reinforcement tho so they will shatter. i wear a face shield when using https://fluf.club/media/e06b2cf1229f280543f9c43269b2fd13a1c98fbef53a0c21af1fd5344768492c.jpg
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: do you need to lubricate the coil for this?
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: this wheel seems better right? https://www.dremel.com/us/en/p/ez409-2615e409ac its a .6mm fibre reinforced wheel they dont sell it here i would have to order the mandrel and wheels from overseas
@67975218 ya those would be good. we have them at the hardware store i think. that's a proprietary system with their dremel arbor though. whereas you can get some cheap ones from ali express with just a hole and generic arbor they're not that dangerous, so if they shatter it might hurt a little- but this is why i wear eye protection plus face shield and gloves, and an apron, and and generally have no probs
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: is the dremel necessary. can i mount the arbor on a drill, or is that a bad idea
@67975218 dremel spins at about 20k rpm. a drill maybe 2k. yes you could try to use a drill but it might be slow and not work that well
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: ok ty, i think a dremel is better then
@67975218 this should work. would make smoke though.
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: that looks pretty good, kinda like the same cut i can do on my aluminium rn using flush cutters but a little more oval ish (sry im a bit of an autist with the ring shape) i would really like to be able to make the rings like picrel though they are just perfect. this guy uses the ringinator also tried to look for how to weld rings, but i can only find info on soldering them. ty for testing it out https://niscii.xyz/files/16ad7f61-9936-4d24-b275-1a36f9934e1b
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @Hypnotize Feminists for thin cuts, what about electrochemical machining? 24 gauge copper sheet is cheap. not sure about the rest of the setup
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: this is a good brand of flex shaft electric die grinders: https://www.foredom.net/product-category/flex-shaft-combinations-kit-and-sets/ if you have a decent air compressor just use an air grinder
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: oh man these are like $500 heh. dremels are also decent and cheaper
@woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: yea the flex shaft is expensive and the kit for jump rings for it cant even do steel, i think i wont pay that much more for the other machine i linked and can rest assured it will work with a nice drill. but again i wont worry about it for now and check back in a year or so :blobcat:
@67975218 @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: HSS blades can cut stainless steel, but it's a hard material so they'll get dull faster than mild steel
@67975218 @woodland creature :pleroma_fox_tan: @creator of #fediblock :verified::makemeneko: mm say flex shaft again emma-chan
