Oddbean new post about login | logout Is monero scarce? Is monero decentralized? Does monero have proof of work?
Is Bitcoin as private as Monero? Monero has a soft cap. It doesn't attempt to recreate scarcity. Decentralized more so than Bitcoin. Asic resistant algorithm allows for egalitarian mining done at home. Its value lies in its ease of use and privacy.
Im not too familiar with monero, so i cant speak to: is bitcoin as private as monero? By default, probably not but we all have our responsibility and i would argue bitcoin can/could be as private as monero. If zaps ⚡️ were built on top of monero, how would that look?
That doesn’t need to happen tho
Interesting, monero transactions/fees* scale easily so we can zap anyone layer 1? again limited monero knowledge 😅
Yes as well as the blockchain itself to handle large amount of transactions
How fees works for monero? Can we check it live like mempool for btc ?
Its not as interesting as mempool.space since you can't see sender,receiver and amount.
I mean, if such thing exist for the part of live fees priority and cost
Monero txs are so cheap (usually less than .01 USD) basically nobody worries about it. There was an issue with some network flooding a few months ago where people who needed to get a tx in a block had to up their fee. But that was the first Ive heard of any fee market in years.
That was an attack on dnm… they made $300k stealing from them…
no cap? they were somehow brute forcing privkeys? how did flooding txs steal xmr? which DNM was the target?
what a monero block explorer looks like FYI https://localmonero.co/blocks/
if you had it setup I could zap this https://image.nostr.build/028199f95879cd31f6675023dc2d17d5d5897772373b674a780d2712af0898a6.jpg
The average XMR fee is very low compared to BTC https://image.nostr.build/c66c1d6711cc586c1cbf2f378064e30979d434e921ca3aab3397ff270b2dbb79.jpg
by default, not at all. and bitcoin could possibly be as private as monero, with a hard fork. OR we're left trying to do shit on L2s, which will always have serious drawbacks. There is a extremely strong argument for compulsory privacy on L1.
Do you admit it only had utility in this aspect and nothing else so therefore not money.
Monero has all the properties of money. Bitcoin does not. cope. https://image.nostr.build/986286384c78b0a0c0a91861139b7c72e24a8a8b414e1dad9e15d127f9e1125c.jpg
Can you elaborate on why it states btc is ❌ fungible?
Tainted coins can be rejected.
Tainted? Rejected by who?
anyone with a block explorer and enough knowledge to follow the money. they are going to map the entire utxo set using existing KYC/AML info and assign confidence scores to all of it large institutions will pay CA to help them avoid tainted, risky utxos.
Seems arbitrary and at an individual level the argument falls apart. Because a person or institution decides to not accept a specific utxo doesnt make that thing init of itself nonfungible. Individuals can do what they please.
the point is that it is possible to differentiate between utxos of the same 'value' IOW, 'value' is not the only characteristic of a new utxo. Because the ledger is transparent, 'history' is also communicated. And because their 'history' is not the same, utxos of the same 'value' are nonfungible. by definition. yes and *then* people can make whatever decisions they want. but we have decided that "fungible" means that units of equal size cannot be differentiated from each other. and bitcoin is not that.
Rare sats for example.
Rare sats are funny 😂 an example but a silly example. I see the perspective of the history, metadata about this utxo chain but this is at the human level. Imposed onto it. At the network level a utxo is a utxo. A sat is a sat, no matter how long or short its chained history is. Sure obfuscation of this history seems to provide ppl ”value” but not on the network.
sure whatever. nodes don't care. its still not fungible in real life. de facto nonfungible. so let's all go ahead get over the fact and move on bitcoin does NOT have all the properties of money it's probably never going to have strong privacy and its a big fucking problem
https://image.nostr.build/3f1f53eef8f5124c7ad6bc9697215f8135969dc91ce79d0ae4dd471a82c4b0c7.jpg If there was only a list of exchanges oh wait...
Unique histories are the opposite of fungible (uniformity, indistinguishable among other units)
The argument about scarcity is not quite right actually. Over infinity, sure, Monero is not scarce, such as Bitcoin is. However, over a lifetime, it definitely is scarce enough to work as proper money. less than 0.9% inflation per year and falling. The tiny amount of inflation is meant to replace what gets lost through loss of private keys, etc.
Yes, comma, yes, comma, and yes.
And that is what I get for dictating on nostr. Now, that will always be remembered.
https://image.nostr.build/2ff26ab74fda0bdd1ef2129561cdafd430315f4f49ee117ffcbe67bf63db4a1c.jpg
nostr:nprofile1qqs0he0gpmydkhzrncjc94ten5j79l5tjk93ah6etgtn4cwg4t6xqacpz4mhxue69uhhyetvv9ujuerpd46hxtnfduhsqvdrkh do you have a Monero address I can add to my cake wallet?
49aCRpnbmjaCsCcuqj43dHS29xWVpfxoz57TUqwDcoksQ7bAghk8GEXc8c23oYDtJ8NadVMNMQKSqa1SsCwMEKwqDr7VXPY
Each has its own purpose
Anyone running a laptop can mine. Private money in the hands of the private person. nostr:nevent1qqsqxg4wqy7r2ds2e835g4k7v9rjyamv2kr8cvanculsxgc6nwlqe6qpzdmhxue69uhk7enxvd5xz6tw9ec82c30qgs0he0gpmydkhzrncjc94ten5j79l5tjk93ah6etgtn4cwg4t6xqacrqsqqqqqpl0sgxs
Is that even profitable?
I will argue that you are buying a privacy coin with your electric bill.
Fair enought, the matter is still if that's worth baking your CPU or not. Even bitcoin is technically minable from CPU, but good luck with that. But I would argue that I don't even care about the difference between Bitcoin mining and monero mining if the likelihood to get profits is still substantially low. 0.0000001% vs 0.00001% is different, but hell I'm not going into if for that much hustle.
yeah... you should check out liquid network
“Trusted team that doesn’t work for profit” https://image.nostr.build/d9a7db0ee50c943685e5c97ef7339be20825c3256f87dfed50f20e387411e428.jpg
You left out poor (unsurprisingly)
The primal objective is become anonymous, not rich sir
Monero boys are smart enough to value privacy but too stubborn to coinjoin True libertarians I'll give you that
We don't need coinjoin. Monero is anonymous by default
da fuck? all my utxos have cj history homie. difference is, my xmr doesn't need it.
Why bother with xmr if you can just coinjoin and be rich at the same time?
there's a meme for this. but basically, CJs are expensive, utxos management is hard, you need to be organized so you dont compromise whatever privacy you gain, and as of today, without Whirlpool there are NO good CJ implementations active, so it's not really an option anyway So you could figure out a kludgey and expensive workaround, study up on the CJ implementation so you really understand what kind of entropy you are gaining and what foot guns are possible etc or you could you know, just use monero.
I'm willing to make that effort to both preserve my privacy and be wealthy Plus all my spending is over lightning which already has near perfect privacy so double makes monero useless to me I gave it an honest chance, had some and mined some, but all I could do with it was lose purchasing power and buy drugs
If LN is private it's only because nobody is looking (yet). and its only sender privacy, we know receive privacy is nonexistent. But you're really just giving up custody arent you??? Just recreate the fiat system online and trust the bank right? 😩
You don't have to give up any custody to use lightning, you just have to run your own node. (It's hard I admit) With a bit of effort you can receive with privacy as well.
I have been looking into the Alby Hub thing... But yeah, so far LN has definitely not been a legitimate privacy tool. Maybe the UX improving with sovereign nodes will change that. or maybe ecash will. but they haven't yet and every year the maxis are crowing about *something* that will do the job. but there's just nothing so far except noise. monero remains undefeated.
Have you looked into Zeus? Only lightning wallet with acceptable privacy from the LSP.
I installed it after their big update to try it out. It did not just work and I couldn't be pissed to screw around with it
Yeah it's a bit clunky but worth looking into it. First lightning wallet I feel comfortable using instead if xmr. For most things at least.
I use Phoenix for when I need to use LN. It's ok for my threat model.
You assuming that Monero Bros are not "rich in fiat terms" is very interesting as most people I know in Monero have been in Bitcoin from the very beginning and most of them have a core position in Bitcoin. So I guess it is them who started to value their privacy much more early than you as they akready have a need for a private store of value and a means to privately spend their Bitcoins.
Bitcoin boys are smart enough to value privacy but too stubborn to use monero True libertarians I'll give you that (actually not really. I think it's gay as shit) nostr:nevent1qqs9sd6slp2rhxf08q3neufwk6wl96t529uuyxd5gpcazsmkfhwv0jqpr3mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmqzyr3vea70ypqr70e2ff2mx28smca78p2c5l2lxd3jlk4wl3exc8ywkqcyqqqqqqg923k2a
Do you have a Monero address I can add to my cake wallet?
And the concept of being rich or poor is very subjective, I think. A king on the middle ages had less luxury and comfort than a average middle class American nowadays
This is a good point. When maxis say "rich" or "poor" they don't mean "abundance" or " able to enjoy some luxury " they mean a higher or lower socioeconomic position *relative to themselves.* So HFSP doesn't just mean "I'm sorry you won't reap the benefits of higher buying power" it means "i will occupy a superior economic caste than you because you are an impure shitcoiner" That's why it's an arrogant obnoxious thing to say. Reeks of smugness and the self-gratified pride of someone who needs their ass kicked.
Yes, lower than 0.9% inflation, Yes more than 500 developers alongside the world, Yes.
