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 Push towards inevitable spam-prevention such as web-of-trust score 
 Say goodbye to walk-in newbies if that happens... 
 Full write access to everyone is not an option. Unconnected newbies could maybe zap to get noticed. 
 Spammers could too. Let peers learn to detect and block spam. Make spam block filter lists exportable and importable so that they can be shared. Spam filters will be spammed to the point of spam implosion. 
 I was a walk-in, with no idea Zaps were a thing. And I came from SSB, so not exactly untechnical.

This DoS is actually very stupid and simple, and Nostr is choking. I get that our relay operators are volunteers and "weekend warriors", but man, its been 24 hrs... 
 Proof of Work? Then the walk in newbie doesn't need Bitcoin - just a nostr client...  
 There's a NIP for that already, and using it would stop an attack this primitive in its tracks 
 Users who are concerned about more sophisticated attacks could also benefit from adding context to their social graph so that the context can be factored in to their WoT calculation 
 Spammers have better resources for PoW than the average mobile user 
 Indeed, this is a tricky problem... Perhaps we will need to accept a combination of multiple approaches with their trade-offs. 
 Absolutely! 🚀 Nostr is a cool way for newcomers to dive in. No need for complex stuff. Just keep it simple and fun for everyone! Let’s spread the word! 👍✨ 
 I'm a walk-in newbie, no sats. I like participating. Proof-of-Posts/Participation(Work) is the way forward.  Go beg/borrow/study FUTO's harbor social vouching process and see if there is something to learn or cooperate with their collaborative vouching model... I think it all depends on the network effect, so nostr will ace that, but FUTO has grayjay aced... So many wheels to reinvent. 🤔 
 That is also terrible for onboarding the (currently almost mythological) non-bitcointwitter newbies, who for the most part join here on zero sats.

nostr:naddr1qqm8qun9wd6hqur0wd5kueedv4mx2unedahx2tt2da5kuuedveex7mfdvf5hgcm0d9h8gamfw36x2u3dwp4kymec0ypzp89qh469qapddgsrr8qw84xx08y7q34fm3cw3m64c2g9ufq9ydqtqvzqqqr4gu6ykx2j 
 How would you limit write access then? Storage and bandwidth are limited, and will be filled with spam unless you limit write access somehow. 
 24 hours of what? The spam?  
 A bot spammer is a lot more likely to be willing to zap "for attention" than a newbie. Also, you don't get to decide who has the right to write.

Instead of spending so much time and energy trying to figure out ways to censor content and effectively make Nostr more vulnerable and unsafe to use, the tech-inclined minds could focus on developing more sophisticated client-side tools that empower users to curate their own feed themselves, the way they like. 
 How would you solve the spam problem (without it being "censorship")? 
 I just told you. Give users client-side more sophisticated solutions that allow them to curate their feed by themselves. Right now I can mute words, works OK at the basic level. Being able to block regular expressions would be even better. 
 Blocking by regex would be dope  
 FYI, because I set the minimum WoT score to 1, I missed this note at first. 
 Spammers would just start producing variant messages that won't match a regex 
 It was just a very simple example of an improvement that would require little cost while empowering users and respecting their freedom, compared to the false solutions commonly discussed. 
 How to solve it on the relay side without blocking newbies? 
 I don't want any relay-side "solutions". That's what would make Nostr unsafe to use and, in fact, threaten its very existence. 
 Storage and bandwidth are limited, you can't give unlimited write access to everyone. 
 I hope we can do p2p between clients in the future, skipping the relay part 
 That would be my absolute favorite option. But as long as we run on relays, I want relays to do exactly what their name says: to relay. They're not called "filters", "funnels" or "publishers". 
 horrendously bad idea as well as invites 
 WoT is a fucking disaster and incompatible with onboarding new users, at least as implemented by nostr:nprofile1qythwumn8ghj7un9d3shjtnwdaehgu3wvfskuep0qy88wumn8ghj7mn0wvhxcmmv9uq32amnwvaz7tmjv4kxz7fwv3sk6atn9e5k7tcpr3mhxue69uhksmmyd33x7epwvdhhyctrd3jjuar0dak8xtcqyz8vs6kfuyyhnxvx2grgae4sqg3m3cext24m8l3gld4nkm3fftwfv4933km  . 
 Nostr invite codes? Is that a silly idea? 
You could have receiver pays fees for people who already have sats. Or sender paid fee for people without sats. With a very small fee. (What is even a small fee that is also a spam deterrent?)

How silly is this idea? Possibly incredibly silly and impractical #asknostr 
 Yeah, invite code to paid relay would be one simple solution to newbie-friendly spam prevention. This is not limiting anyone's freedom: users can always choose what clients and relays they use. What works best will be most popular. 
 Paying the fee is hard unless you're already a keen Bitcoiner, and are also quite sure Nostr is for you without having seen it.

The invites is workable, but still, what about the "walk-ins" who read something about Nostr and decided to come check it out? Who are probably the majority of new users... 
 I suppose in this scenario (I'm not saying it will or should happen btw) the article the person would have read would also mention this invite codes mechanism. Not sure how that would work but um yeah lol. They would still need to go somewhere for an invite code. Or use a pow service like special purpose version of a pow posting service like getwired.app to ask for one?
¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯ 
 I feel like I'm digging a hole here lol 
 i think pow is easy to implement without significantly affecting UX.
if default difficulty is something like 10, no users are gonna notice, but spam reply bots suddenly require a lot more resources 
 yea that was also my thinking, PoW won't help for one-to-many spam (as the work can be amortized over many targeted users), but for mass DM/reply spam it might, a bit
 
 yes, and one-to-many spam is where a ‘web of trust’ can be applied without any onboarding trade-offs 
 I'm totally out of my depth in this thread. I merely just wanted to say I think it could scare off zero sats people. And now I have to read dev words I've never seen before in my life 🥲 
 More ideas, the better! 
 I appreciate you humouring me lol 😂