Oddbean new post about login | logout Geyser Fund has shut down the crowdfunding project Bitcoin for Palestine, citing regulatory uncertainty. Let this be your reminder that you cannot code faster than the state can invoke arbitrary penalties. Permissionless money is under massive threat by the global AML regime. It's time to wake up. Full story: https://www.therage.co/geyser-bitcoin-for-palestine/
@lyuda_kozlovska
Yes, I have seen this and we had discussions with @geyser sometime ago about that risks. But they as financial business representatives are doing classical preventative steps if they want to operate legally according the #AML regulation in the #EU. Unfortunately, nobody wants to support financially advocacy in defense of freedom tech in the #EU. It is a sad fact. The only donors you may expect to support such work are in the US, like @jackspirko @brockm @obi @alvaro . Moreover, I know that many EU bitcoiners find our work educating policymakers about the need to protect #freedomtech and analytical reports on regulatory threats boring and unnecessary. More boring still, they find our calls to protect the #privacy of payments and communication. But what's happening with #Geyser is just the tip of the iceberg, and this trend is only going to accelerate if WE don't stop it. We predicted such developments back in April : https://en.odfoundation.eu/content/uploads/2024/04/18.04.2024_btc-coalition-submission_eng.pdf There is no one else who will protect your and my #privacy. That's why it's critical to join forces to preserve and expand a safe environment for developers, investors, and users of freedom technologies. Also, I find hopes of the ‘living in a parallel society’ approach a bit utopian, because I have been working constantly for 15 years now with activist groups in authoritarian countries, where by default all dissenters survive in an exclusionary/parallel society regime. It is not their choice, but rather punishment - #exclusion. They survive on the support of Western partners and freedom technology. But in authoritarian countries freedomtech is not created. There is no one there to fund it, and if someone tries - I recommend reading our recent reports on what happens to such donors: https://en.odfoundation.eu/content/uploads/2024/07/05.07.2024_report_mendygaziyev_eng_updated.pdf This is why I think it is crucial to build support with politicians, and to educate people in general about the importance of protecting freedoms and privacy technology. Because (1) any business that requires investment and (2) any developer of privacy tools that is not just air-fuelled - will be under regulatory pressure with the current dynamics of AML/CFT regulations in western countries. Even worse situation in the rest/non-democratic world. So unless there is a serious joint effort to protect the privacy of communications and payments in the EU - the situation will only get worse and will spread from the EU to other jurisdictions too. #Nostr #relay operators have the same vulnerability - they could be pressured into ‘deplatforming’ too.
Sorry tagged @jackspirko instead of @jack ☺️
Unfortunately, it shows how vulnerable it is to always depend on third parties. Geyserfund's work is very commendable in these cases. There is still a need for the end users themselves to manage their own funds in these cases. Hopefully these users in war zones will learn better practices. And maybe Geyfund will evolve to a more self-custodial version. Who knows
Geyser is fully self-custodial. With governments going as far as attempting to criminalize the building of UIs (see Tornado Cash), this is not a question of self custody. Any project building software to interface with the Bitcoin network utilized to send money where governments don't want to see it is at risk.
Okey. The picture is clearer 👍 So here they are practically forcing the whole development not to have a face, a recognized address. Since they want to go after everything that interacts with the Net. The attacks from Tornado and Samourai are already making it very clear how the governments are acting. It is sad. But for now this is a wake-up call about geyser. They will push harder and harder and in other ways. It is time to be antifragile within the community.
UNLICENSED MONEY TRANSMITTER 🤣
I can see no valid reason why people shouldn't be able to transmit money to anywhere or anyone, without first obtaining a "license."
100% agree, just joking around
You can't even try to help people under Jewish Zionist occupation that are literally being genocided, we all have just to watch praise and go sent to die for Jewish Israeli Zionist wars. nostr:nevent1qqsv2w94wgrlj6xn6q9xylcclpsa6a8k4zfexwhpujwnj0tcg3mfpcgppemhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mp0qgsd3fhv7rped64g77dyf9l7ndmae9mkxdz37099cc6wyzr9jytxg7crqsqqqqqpf02c2s
To be honest, all these aid projects for Ukraine or Palestine either seem like scams, or the funds are used to purchase weapons for military purposes.
To be honest, maybe you should do some due diligence before running your mouth on social media.
to be honest, non profit government registered organisations are all political lobby organs, or they are working for big pharma, big agra, or other scammy fascist corporations there might be a couple that aren't either outright or cloaked deceptions but those are probably little local things that you never heard of
Within Ukraine the supermajority of fundraising is to buy more drones to kill Russians. Drones are one of the most effective tools Ukraine has, and unlike other weapons, the parts for them can be easily bought commercially. Of course the fundraising is going to purchase weapons. Killing Russians is how Ukrainians stop Russians from killing them. Solve the root cause of the problem. Not the symptoms. https://image.nostr.build/b2c09e44c2c82aa07d472fbfa77c242acf0cb12af39b13796ac24f0781d64555.jpg
Even leaving aside the fact that there are as many Ukrainians among these Russians as there are Ukrainians among Ukrainians, so in the end, they are killing themselves. It's one thing when the fundraising is declared openly, and it's completely different when you're being fed lies that the money is going to help children and the elderly.
"as many Ukrainians among these Russians" 😂 This isn't some complex moral quandary. Russia is trying to invade Ukraine to take their land and steal their resources. Russians are fighting this war for money: the Russian military is promising huge (for Russia) salaries to soldiers. If it was successful, it would have been a very profitable war because Ukraine has trillions or dollars worth of resources to steal; Russia has already stolen something like a trillion dollars worth of land and resources already.
Ukraine has no resources worth trillions of dollars; they only have billions in debt and cheap labor for the EU. And even if those "trillions of dollars" worth of resources did exist, the U.S. would simply take them for free, just as they've done in the Middle East.
😂😂😂 Just in the occupied areas, there's about $12 trillion worth of resources, including coal, iron ore, etc. https://www.dw.com/en/russia-ukraine-war-natural-resources-grain/a-66639269 And Ukraine has more top quality topsoil than any other country in the world. There's a reason why they're (still) one of the world's top food exporterers. As for the US, they haven't taken resources for free.
The valuation of coal and gas in Ukraine changes every time depending on who is conducting the assessment. In any case, coal is not something that can be expensive in the modern green agenda, and the development of other resources in Ukraine did not occur because modern Ukraine did nothing but steal Russian gas from pipelines and sell children for prostitution and organ transplantation to Europe. Regarding this amusing statement, considering that even under the impoverished conditions of Ukraine, the Biden family thrived there. Hunter Biden especially enjoyed himself with Ukrainian escorts.
there probably is more than one reason to do what russia is doing. i do tend to believe their claim to make ukraine abandon their nato aspirations, and there probably are more reasons, like, for example, the persistant corruption scheme with russian gas that has made ukrainian oligatchs millions. funny how the start of the war coincided with completion deadline for northstream pipelines
There are many reasons, ranging from purely historical ones, such as Kiev being literally the cradle of the Russian world, to economic and military factors. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsjKZstp-XU&t=81
with ukraine, the majority of funding claims is to "buy" "drones" or other equipment. actually, there is very little accounting for where the money is actually going
I hate to break it to you, but a lot of people who are into bitcoin are not into funding wars at all, regardless of which side.
Neutrality is ideal, but her point is that they are citing 'regulatory concerns, which means that govs and politics still dictate the money flow, so decetralization is a pipe dream.
This is nonsense talk along the lines of "If my leftist view is contradicted, it must be government intervention. Collecting money to effect change is never neutral. Moreover, the money flows are free, but people are not free from the real-world consequences of their real-world actions with that money. Considering this is not „AML regime intervention“ (although it could be of course). I know many bitcoiners like to ignore this, but there is a good reason why Satoshi chose not to make bitcoin fully encrypted and private. Not just technical but societal ones. It's very complex, but bitcoiners on the right and left (aka masked collectivists) don't like complexity. They just like to use bitcoin as a vehicle for their political nonsense. I don’t trust her on this one.
The didn't fund the war. They've built shelters and bought food for the victims of this conflict. They've done outstanding humanitarian work over the last year while the US and the EU are still trying to figure out how to do the same.
Money intended for humanitarian aid is regularly diverted to oppressors of all kinds. It's *the* central problem most organizations face when trying to set up operations to help people in need. It's impossible to rule out this possibility.
but it's possible to make the assumption based on what? Yussuf has been very transparent with the project and I'd suggest to dig into it before forming an opinion.
I am not assuming in this particular case, but you have to take perspective of the geyser fund. Impossible to verify, but high risk from the political environment alone. And just to reiterate, my original point is that inferring "AML regime intervention" instead of just a player hedging risks is over the top.
I understand what you're saying but I've supported that project over the last year and followed very closely. The money went where it was meant to go. Into food and shelter for those displaced by the Israelin aggressors. Shows us once again why we need to built more tamper- and censorship resistant services. The moment there is a company behind a project there's an attack vector to limit the service or even shut it down.
I understand your sentiment, since you have deeper knowledge of the project than most people. If it's a company, it can be pressured, and even if it's not, the people running it have to make tradeoffs that wouldn't be made in a decentralized setup.
I agree 100%. This is why incorporating is overrated in our space.
Dang it. Thanks for letting us know. 🫡
lightning is AML compliance, no surprises
Really? How so?
This is not really about coding as much as it is about most crypto innovation being about the same old tired paradigm of trying to disrupt and inject oneself into gatekeeper positions. It continues to amaze me all of these crypto bzillionaires who are so thanks to a windfall for their beliefs, are so dead set on continuing the model of VC funding and begging for the empire to grant them leave to operate.
Do some of these projects have npubs with zap addresses set up? Seems like that could be a viable (and difficult to censor) way to receive funding and also share updates with funders.
They have a self hosted BTCPay server: https://btcpay.foragoodcause.xyz/apps/37W6GRGutGU9a4F61uHeFcjHFyQv/crowdfund I saw on his X profile. Maybe it’s time to convince them to come to Nostr.
Yussef is on nostr.
Yes, the guys name is @Yusef . He’s not active in nostr but this is his lighting wallet. Here’s his Twitter handle https://x.com/yusef_mahmoud1?s=21&t=hB_1ujRRfTGjvAVfy8U8Uw
This is devastating and also a reminder that we need decentralized platforms, there is no other way forward. nostr:note1c5ut2us8l95d85q2vfl337rpm460d2ynjvawreya8y7hs3rkjrssvch7ky
When a platform is built by a for-profit entity that has raised funds, it's easy for the state to target it and pressure founders. Open Source protocols can live past their founders. Nostr-native crowdfunding marketplaces like fundsolvr.com are necessary. Build the change you want to see. https://github.com/Open-Source-Justice-Foundation/Fundsolvr nostr:nevent1qqsv2w94wgrlj6xn6q9xylcclpsa6a8k4zfexwhpujwnj0tcg3mfpcgpr4mhxue69uhkummnw3ezucnfw33k76twv4ezuum0vd5kzmp0qgsd3fhv7rped64g77dyf9l7ndmae9mkxdz37099cc6wyzr9jytxg7crqsqqqqqp8duz77
Bitcoin is unaffected. Centralized crowdfunding platforms are not Bitcoin.
So we need a “Conflict Zone Geyser.”
Perhaps our admirable developers will soon be able to code faster than the banker-owned state can act, as their numbers increase and the state's competence decreases due to its own DEI policies, etc. But I do see your point. There's actually no such thing as "money laundering." Concealing the source of one's funds in various ways is done constantly by individuals, governments, "NGO"s, charities, activists, freedom fighters -- the list goes on and on. Each has its reasons, some I'd agree with and some I wouldn't. But they only call it "money laundering" very rarely and selectively. Like legally-defined "racketeering" (which usually isn't racketeering at all), it's just a way for the people in power to hurt someone they don't like or for career advancement in the fiat system.
BREAKING: Geyser shuts down Bitcoin for Palestein citing fears the Jews will explode their hardware wallets nostr:note1c5ut2us8l95d85q2vfl337rpm460d2ynjvawreya8y7hs3rkjrssvch7ky
this sucks! This project did great things for the poor people stuck in the middle of the conflict in Palestine. nostr:nevent1qvzqqqqqqypzpk9xancv89h24rme53yhl6dh0hyhwce528eu5hrrfcsgvkg3vermqqsv2w94wgrlj6xn6q9xylcclpsa6a8k4zfexwhpujwnj0tcg3mfpcguert8n
Capitalism is the mental illness that makes people think money can help Palestine. You can't solve every problem by throwing more money at it. Gaza is walled in and aid trucks are blocked from entering and aid workers are constantly under attack and the people doing this have too many guns and nukes and brainwashed minions to care about money. Money won't bring victory. If there is victory it must come from smart people with guns outnumbering brainwashed minions with guns, and somehow outsmarting brainwashed minions with nukes.
If you want to use your money to help Gaza, use it to arm yourself or pay homeless people to burn government buildings or something. Don't send it to scammers saying they can use it to help Gaza on the internet with zero explanation of how that's supposed to magically work for a place that's walled in letting aid trucks go to waste.
If you absolutely insist on sending money to help Gaza, it should probably go to regular people connected to Gaza, or nearby allies like the West Bank and Lebanon. Not random donation drives on the internet run by people acting like they can't understand how money would seem useless.
Gazaians just need to read the Bitcoin White paper and fix the money so they can fix everything else
Are you picking the wrong person to try to joke about this with or do you seriously not comprehend that pretty much every weapon in the Isreali or American arsenal can get through a Bitcoin wallet as easily as a dollar bill?
I am making fun of Bitcoiners bruh.
Sorry for not being in the right mental state to laugh. I'm thankful you weren't being serious.
The fact that you could not tell means that Nostr has a problem with a group of people lol Let's call them the Nostr Jews
It's also just me being paranoid/jumpy without Digit in general
Please Please Please show me something about this Digit that proves her existence
The best proof you could get would be if you have Discord to ask about her on wallstreetbets where I'm banned and everyone knew her. https://discord.gg/wallstreetbets If you go there, please screen record it or take screenshots to post with every bit of info you get. If you don't have Discord, here are some screenshots of me searching "I miss Digit" on the wallstreetbets subreddit. Only like 2 of the comments in these search results are mine https://image.nostr.build/9b066598dce9673c3354f73790c801fad98363b9fc4bda3b9ad47dba5d1dc750.jpg https://image.nostr.build/9e03474324b25cb6df9c1e9747beaa85188c7cc4f34b3ee7076b92f47adcb04e.jpg https://image.nostr.build/b350b64fdc79c1083ec9e1e87367704994a72853e28d49565cfe85aad7b6c816.jpg https://image.nostr.build/01386e55c854f2e5f2fd08f51b8d5894a3639d06deebedf81c2e741059422fd8.jpg https://image.nostr.build/a03bbd8a2469fe27a47499b8047eb2504265f293f6ef413fa59cca12d99e31ab.jpg I don't know what else to show you, I never got better proof of her being real than just talking to her and watching streams with her in voice chat a couple times. She's real
has it ever occurred to you that you can use money to flee to safety?
I've heard that, but I haven't seen any proof it's true AT ALL, and haven't seen any sign of analysis of how it would be helpful rather than resulting in the money being used to cause more suffering to others than is escaped by whoever uses the money to escape.
Thank you for covering this 🙏
What @Yusef is doing in Gaza is one of the most powerful applications of “freedom money” we’ve ever seen since Bitcoin was launched. It exemplifies the most noble and good aspect of Bitcoin in the face of unimaginable evil and horror. For anyone who still wants to donate and support this great man, he’s not active on Nostr, but here’s his Twitter handle: https://x.com/yusef_mahmoud1?s=21&t=hB_1ujRRfTGjvAVfy8U8Uw
that's exactly why we need Bitcoin so that they can't stop transactions even if they want to
Wow, i will never use Geyser again and i am in the top 5 of all time donors on the platform. Fuck off @geyser nostr:note1c5ut2us8l95d85q2vfl337rpm460d2ynjvawreya8y7hs3rkjrssvch7ky
Governments always go after "controversial" causes to change platforms and make companies and their leaders fearful. I love the work Geyser is doing, but at the end of the day, this is why protocols matter more than companies. nostr:note1c5ut2us8l95d85q2vfl337rpm460d2ynjvawreya8y7hs3rkjrssvch7ky
Lola is probably the best independent journalist in the Bitcoin space right now, sad news from geyser nostr:nevent1qqsv2w94wgrlj6xn6q9xylcclpsa6a8k4zfexwhpujwnj0tcg3mfpcgpz9mhxue69uhkummnw3ezuamfdejj7q3qmznweuxrjm423au6gjtlaxmhmjthvv69ru72t335ugyxtygkv3asxpqqqqqqzau36ya
Please stop conflating companies with bitcoin. A company making a decision not to list a certain cause is not bitcoin being under threat. Palestinians can still use bitcoin just the same as before this announcement.
one can definitely code faster than the state. the reminder is to stay low and not run and advertise the service as a business model yourself (samourai) and write code that routes around the arbitrary rules, as a free individual and not like a regulated entity (geyser)
That is why we will always wield both a pen and sword
