Oddbean

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I find creatr to be too hard to use. I’m sure it’s easy if you’re the kind of person who uses bitcoin and lightening outside of Nostr, but for normies this is hard. If i could pay for it FROM a nostr app, with a zap, then it’d be easier. But as it is, it’s like go use x software, then y software, then copy this code (relay address) and put it in the right spot. As a proof of concept, i like it, and i’m excited about being able to pay for subscription content on nostr, but this needs some user testing.

We could certainly DM an invoice - that’s easy to do. How should a user signal they want an invoice from within their nostr client? We could make it a chat bot with commands like @Wino [Bot] but that seemed a bit archaic to me.

Maybe there could be some kind of “subscribe now” button on the paywall splash? Or maybe the link that takes them to the website currently instead just says subscribe now and if you click it a dm is sent? Or even better would be that link just auto generates an invoice for that npub and sends them to a wallet for payment?

Honestly i’m not sure, we need to realize there are a bunch of different kinds of users, a ton of nostr apps, wallets, etc… I know dmpling.com most people choose to login via a DM vs nip-07. What we really need to do is come up with design prototypes for a bunch options and user flow. Ideally there’d be a way to do it all from within whatever nostr client you’re using, second best is something that feels like an oauth flow, that we know works for users.

We will add a DM flow for subscriptions and try to come up with more ways to reduce friction! We’d also love to see more clients support NIP-98 headers on specific requests so we can support nostr native access control to files. I’m not sure how we should signal to a client that a particular link requires a NIP-98 header or how the client should get permission from the end user to include it. We could also experiment with the “NOTIFY” spec that Vitor drafted. This lets the relay send a message to the user directly that the client can display. We use these to show renewal notices for filter.nostr.wine in Amethyst.

Really appreciate your hard work and willingness to experiment in this new nostr world! UX is a huge pain point at the moment but only through trial and error will nostr succeed! Really think you’re innovating at the highest level in this space at nostr.wine

Alright - got this done today! You can now DM @Creatr with /subscribe npub and it will respond with an invoice. You can optionally include the desired tier and number of days otherwise it defaults to tier 1 and 30 days. Example: /subscribe npub 1 30 Clients could do this in the background to make authenticated subscriptions as well.

Creatr also supports NWC (via https://github.com/nostr-protocol/nips/pull/851). You can DM /nwc connect and get a connection string to paste in to your wallet (currently only supported by Mutiny but Alby as well soon) and automatically receive invoices as they are due. I currently see this as the best path forward to reducing payment friction, just needs more wallet support.

bravo i'm working from fiatjaf's khatru and just been implementing a chatbot and holy moly what a mess i dug up poking at this... i'm turning off nip42 and using an IP whitelist to stop outsiders from touching my relay and just getting one thing working at a time at this point... your relay is FOSS and has a repo somewhere right?

I agree that it’s not ready for prime time. That’s why I primarily use it in a way where there are public images followed by subscription imagery. This way people can still see some of my work and zap me the normal nostr way. Also, instead of posting less public stuff, I’m trying to simply post MORE content, keeping my typical 2-3 image posts public but adding an additional 2-3 images to the post as well. I think I might stop “promoting” the creatr aspect all together, as I think it lowers the signal of the art by having “advertising” type language in the post, but I also want to help Mazin spread the word… so that’s a tough one.

Thanks Rabble, appreciate you taking the time. I agree, of course, that there’s too much friction and switching for now. Unfortunately, I think without building our own client (which we strictly want to avoid) there are going to be UX tradeoffs. My perception is zaps aren’t useful for subscriptions. What do they zap? How do they know how much to zap? What happens if a user underpays for a subscription by 1 sat? How about overpays (perhaps even exceeding the max subscription duration limit)? What about if they zap the wrong note or person? Who will track and address these customer support issues? Invoices just work and make sense and NWC makes this process smooth. After your first payment we show a “Connect Wallet” button to send future invoices. If we could get the users wallet connected up front, all they would need to do is signal they wanted to subscribe to a certain user and we would automatically send them a pay req via NWC. Maybe that’s the best route?