Oddbean new post about login | logout # Relays
Tik Tok, X, Facebook, and Instagram all use the old model - a single "relay". With those apps, when you make a post, the post is sent from your phone to the company's "relay". When someone else views your post, their phone downloads your post from the company's "relay". When you follow someone or they follow you, only the company's "relay" knows this. ("Relay" = server)
Nostr uses the new model - one or more relays. With nostr apps, when you make a post, the post is sent from your phone to one or more relays, all owned and controlled by different people. When someone else views your post, their phone downloads the post from anyone of those relays. When you follow someone or they follow you, all your relays and their relays know this.
That's a major difference:
Old = a single company controlled relay/server
Nostr = many independently controlled relays/servers
#introductions #tiktok #nostrexplained #asknostr #new #welcome #relays
Amazing dan, great work friend 😉⚡
nostr:nevent1qqspe9p5tc238c8q7ky8f6fux3cpwfxu9f7yh7eujz24yv9dqsxgrkcpzemhxue69uhky6t5vdhkjmn9wgh8xmmrd9skcq3qgz7uczyg3kvdf8grlwfmllguc3kehrcc05yvnlypkjklptgql5kqxpqqqqqqz2f3xr3
Makes sense, why is it so easy to send sats on this network? ⚡️
That story is more about both Bitcoin/Lightning and Nostr being completely open protocols that anyone can build on. It's not the case that nostr was originally designed to work with Bitcoin/Lighting or visa/versa. @jb55 just had an idea, so he built it. Now everyone uses it. For example, nothing about nostr prevents other types of zaps (other currencies) someone would just have to build it and it would have to catch on (long shot 😉 )
Relays การเปรียบเทียบการทำงานของโซเชียลมีเดียแบบเดิมกับ Nostr โซเชียลมีเดียกระแสหลัก (เช่น X, TikTok, Facebook, Instagram) ใช้ระบบ "รีเลย์" แบบเดิม (รีเลย์ = เซิร์ฟเวอร์) เมื่อคุณโพสต์อะไร ข้อมูลจะถูกส่งจากโทรศัพท์ของคุณไปยังรีเลย์ของบริษัทนั้น เมื่อคนอื่นเห็นโพสต์ของคุณ โทรศัพท์ของพวกเขาจะดาวน์โหลดข้อมูลจากรีเลย์ของบริษัท การติดตามหรือถูกติดตาม รู้ได้เฉพาะรีเลย์ของบริษัทเท่านั้น Nostr ใช้ระบบ "รีเลย์" แบบใหม่ มีรีเลย์ได้ตั้งแต่ 1 ตัวขึ้นไป ซึ่งแต่ละตัวมีเจ้าของและการควบคุมแยกจากกัน เมื่อคุณโพสต์อะไร ข้อมูลจะถูกส่งจากโทรศัพท์ของคุณไปยังรีเลย์ 1 ตัวหรือมากกว่านั้น (คนละเจ้าของ) เมื่อคนอื่นเห็นโพสต์ของคุณ โทรศัพท์ของพวกเขาสามารถดาวน์โหลดข้อมูลจากรีเลย์ใดก็ได้ที่คุณใช้ การติดตามหรือถูกติดตามรีเลย์ของคุณและรีเลย์ของคนที่คุณติดตาม ล้วนรับรู้การกระทำนี้ สรุปความแตกต่าง: ระบบเดิม: ข้อมูลถูกควบคุมโดย "รีเลย์/เซิร์ฟเวอร์" ของบริษัทโซเชียลมีเดียเพียงเจ้าเดียวเท่านั้น Nostr: ข้อมูลกระจายอยู่บน "รีเลย์/เซิร์ฟเวอร์" หลายตัวที่ไม่ขึ้นต่อกัน เราใช้ Gemini แปลนะ #Siamstr nostr:nevent1qqspe9p5tc238c8q7ky8f6fux3cpwfxu9f7yh7eujz24yv9dqsxgrkcpz4mhxue69uhkummnw3ez6un9d3shjtnpwpcqygzqhhxq3zydnr2f6qlmjwll68xydkdc7xrapryleqd54hc26q8a9spsgqqqqqqsqcrs0f
For any new people that fall into the "morning person" category! #introductions #tiktok #nostrexplained #asknostr #new #welcome #relays #coffeechain nostr:note1rj2rghs4z0swpavgwn5ncdrszujdc2nuf0aneyy42gc26pqvs8dskpz6v2
Just thinking. Couldn't tik tok build a client and import all their members onto NOSTR to avoid being ban? Or would it be to difficult to monetize? I would think they could work with customers to push advertising feeds to tik tok clients users the same way they do on a centralized server. No?
Though, too: More infrastructure, widely distributed system means more complexity, more fragility and a bunch of ... interesting effects to address. Some of them, so far, seem to be handled not very well in #nostr , hope this will improve at some point. And maybe not everything of this is technology.
which issues are these?
Re-occurring problem I tend to see here is communication threads being just partially displayed (or quotes referring to stuff I can't see) because messages are sent through different relays. That's the most "visible" aspect. If it works this way, I'd have to be sure to have at least one relay in common with each contact I'm communicating with all the time _and_ this particular relay needs to be available to work well. Generally, accounts being closely tied to servers seems to me one of the major drawbacks in protocols like ActivityPub or Diaspora, but the opposite probably should be much more akin to TCP in general: There's a myriad of unnamed nodes, the protocol makes sure "information" is sent from sender to recipient _under all circumstances_ and will try to choose hops / relays at hand for that to work. The very moment relays become more prominent (like, "choose yours" vs "you're blocked on this one" vs "this one's a paid service", this whole concept seems to give again too much power to individual relays that just shouldn't probably be there).
I understand what you say when you use the word fragility, but it’s exactly the opposite of fragile. Nostr doesn’t “go down” like other platforms have.
Depends on how you understand "goes down". If talking about the network as a whole: True. If talking about the likeliness of communication between two random actors being temporarily interrupted without notice or workaround by the system itself: Unsure.
Agree, but that’s not what fragile means. Maybe unreliable? But how many times does your scenario play out? How unreliable does something have to be to be officially “unreliable”? I’ve only had post not propagate because of clients, not the protocol.
I'm not sure whether this is really the point - or rather the fact that this kind of (obvious) unreliability, including measuring or benchmarking it, hasn't apparently been considered on protocol level. As a participant, an unreliable communication system is (strictly speaking) even worse than one that visibly fails ever then and now...
Just yesterday was tuning into a podcast with Jameson Lopp that was helping me understand the importance of this... Even more freedom geared networks have that same mostly one point of failure set up with servers and control. nostr:nevent1qqspe9p5tc238c8q7ky8f6fux3cpwfxu9f7yh7eujz24yv9dqsxgrkcpp4mhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mqzypqtmnqg3zxe34yaq0ae80larnzxmxu0rp7s3j0usx62mu9dqr7jcqcyqqqqqqgd9aju4
# Nostr Clients Ever felt boxed in by apps like Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook? These platforms are like living in a single-story house with one window—you only get one view of the world, dictated by the company behind the app. This is because they are centralized; everything runs through their one-size-fits-all app, limiting your perspective and control. Enter the Nostr network, a breath of fresh air in a crowded room. Nostr clients are like having keys to an entire city of houses, each with its unique design, windows, and views. You're no longer confined to the limitations of a single app's functionality, design, or rules. With Nostr clients, you can choose an app (client) that resonates with your needs and aesthetic preferences. Want an app that focuses on short form text? There's a Nostr client for that. Want an app that focuses on long form articles/essays? There's a Nostr client for that. Prefer a visually stunning interface for art sharing? There's a client for that too. It's like switching between Instagram for visuals, Twitter for quick updates, and LinkedIn for professional networking—all within the Nostr ecosystem, without ever giving control to one central authority. Nostr clients empower you to navigate the digital world in a way that traditional, centralized apps like TikTok or X can't. They offer a mosaic of experiences, ensuring that your voice, preferences, and interactions remain yours. In the Nostr universe, diversity thrives, and your choice of client is your ticket to exploring this vast, decentralized landscape. #nostr #decentralization #digitalfreedom #choice #diversity #Instagram #Twitter #Facebook #TikTok #X #NostrExplained nostr:nevent1qqspe9p5tc238c8q7ky8f6fux3cpwfxu9f7yh7eujz24yv9dqsxgrkcpp4mhxue69uhkummn9ekx7mqzypqtmnqg3zxe34yaq0ae80larnzxmxu0rp7s3j0usx62mu9dqr7jcqcyqqqqqqgd9aju4