Oddbean

I don’t care why Saylor chooses to own Bitcoin. What I do care about is his demigod status that lets him say we should buy shitcoins like Monero instead of having privacy on Bitcoin. One of the most important characteristics of money is fungibility. Without privacy, Bitcoin cannot be fungible. To make it worse, we have non-fungible tokens on Bitcoin before privacy.

Most maxis either don't understand or are in denial about your last paragraph. Fungibility and privacy are so important for money and refreshing to see this said. Hope that one day Bitcoin will have both.

Privacy is not given, it must be taken. If you use the internet without privacy to begin with, or don't have the will to learn how to take it, you deserve something so private that you will never be able to verify the supply of it and just trust the founding BCN scammers who pre-mined it 🤣

"Privacy is not given, it must be taken." Exactly why I use Monero. I'm not going to beg Bitcoin Core, Blockstream, and the NGU institutional squad for privacy. Optional privacy and layers don't solve fungibility. Monero was a codebase fork. It didn't inherit Bytecoin's blockchain doofus. So no to the premine. You verify Bitcoin by relying on your node to do it for you. Exactly like any Monero user. No Bitcoiner is taking advantage of it's simple transparency to verify supply. You went through hundreds of millions of transactions inside 800,000+ blocks and made sure all inputs = all outputs yourself? You do this every ten minutes? Lol, please, you depend on a node to do this just as much as any Monero user. Be gone larp

I find it really hard to understand how you can both call Monero a shitcoin and yet also correctly recognize the fundamental need for privacy. It is precisely because of that reason that Monero is *not* a shitcoin. I'm sorry but it comes across as close-minded. Monero offers today what we all would like Bitcoin to offer in the future. Therefore, pragmatism demands that Monero be used as the useful tool that it is. It's not either/or. YMMV, me personally I save in BTC but spend in Monero (and to a lesser degree Lightning). And the only reason for that is Monero's always-on privacy. So putting XMR in the same basket as all the other cryptos is a bit naive and ignorant. No offense.

Monero is a shitcoin for a few reasons, but mostly because it does not have anything close to the network effect that Bitcoin has. It certainly cannot be Bitcoin’s properties that make us value it. I can fork Bitcoin right now, give it a different name, and nobody would buy it. It’s the story, and that story will fall apart without privacy. The technology that Monero uses is not shitcoinery at all*, and Bitcoin should steal that technology with BIP300. The existence of Monero breaks the 21 million rule, especially when used as a fake L2. It also encourages economic activity on Monero nodes, and we need that activity on economic Bitcoin nodes. *If anyone thinks the privacy Monero uses is shitcoinery, they should know that Satoshi was already developing it in 2010 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=770.msg9074#msg9074