Oddbean new post about login | logout In my experience many of us carry enough shame for a lifetime. Might be why he can’t understand to begin with.
Nah we live in a shame deficit rn- need more so people stop behaving so badly lol
Respectfully disagree. I believe shame is a huge driver of all sorts of maladaptive and harmful behaviors. Totally agree that people behave poorly and want to see us treat each other better. But perhaps we have different definitions of shame. Care to share yours?
Shame is thinking ur bad. It drives you to behave more bad.
There may be two types of shame- Group and individual. Group shame keeps people from actin bad because they would deviate from group values Individual shame is when a narcissist gets too self obsessed in the negative and acts out to gain attention from the group.
I like Brene Brown’s delineation between guilt and shame. Shame says “I am bad.” Guilt says “I did a bad thing.” In my experience, I act destructively when operating out of shame and constructively when operating from guilt. This framework has been really helpful to me when processing times that I acted out of alignment with my values. I’d like to see a world where everyone is secure in their innate “goodness” but ready and willing to admit when they’ve acted poorly and take necessary steps to make amends. So less shame, more guilt.
No such thing as innate goodness
Heard. I’ve believed that in the past. It didn’t produce fruit for me. So far, assuming divinity in all does.
Breaking the 1st commandant- you shall have no other gods before me. Classic pagan.
It’s more nuanced than that for me. I view the Bible as a text to be wrestled with. It’s never worked as a rule book, especially to hold over others who don’t start from the same assumptions. Again, I come back to fruit. How does my reading of scripture express itself in how I treat myself and those around me? If it leads to more life and peace, perfect. If it leads to disconnection and violence (physical or verbal), no good. You’re free to interpret scripture as you see fit. In fact, I believe you owe it to yourself. I hope however you interpret it leads to more peace and joy in your life.
Exactly. It’s “for you” because you are your own god. It’s never worked “for you” as a rule book. And if your reading leads to better things “for you” then you deem your way correct. I am not free to read it as I see fit, but according to the intent of the author. Just as you are not free to read this message from me and insert your own interpretation which may differ from my intent lol
I appreciate your willingness to dialogue. I completely agree that the intent of the author is of utmost importance in understanding a text. I take issue with your assessment that I am my own god. I don’t believe this. I believe each of us contain some element of divinity. Essentially what animates us and gives us life. I believe there’s scripture that alludes to this, but I don’t remember the passage right now. I also agree that we shouldn’t read scripture and twist it to our own benefit. I’m curious, what tools do you use to help you interpret what you read well?
Greek and Hebrew lol
I agree with this.
I would say we live in a guilt deficit. People behave poorly and don’t know how to process the guilt of their behavior, which leads to shame.
No need to process guilt- just stop bein bad lol