Oddbean

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 @fa46ee30 

I doubt Putin is that smart.  He can't even manage his own country without resorting to transparent murder.

I think we have to accept that the US has some foundational flaws in its own system that are finally catching up to it.

Not that the flaws in the US and the Russian system are equal.  I mean, Russia has undergone like 5 revolutions in the time the US has had 2 civil wars.  

But that's not the point. It's that we can't blame everything on one man.

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 @a8671fa0 

Forgive me if I firmly contradict you

it's not a question of being 'smart'
It's just experience in -using- people
and it is the same system with which #Putin 'gain loyalty' in #Russia
money and fear
like a 'loan-shark' does

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 @fa46ee30 

There is some statistical perspective we can apply to put this in context, and I think it supports my position pretty strongly.

All told, Hilary Clinton spent about $769 million during the 2016 election.

https://www.opensecrets.org/pres16/candidate?id=N00000019

Even the most aggressive estimates, which few people believe, say that Russia spent no more than $300k--0.039% of Hilary's spending.

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 @a8671fa0 
come on Robert

let's be serious

#Putin's contribution to #Trump's presidential campaign was not financial
🤣
(he's not that stupid)
it was propaganda
70% control of misinformation on the media 
and social networks...
way more devastating
and it is still present

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 @fa46ee30 

That's my point--you think Putin knows America well enough to direct propaganda here whereas he clearly failed in Ukraine?  That just doesn't make sense.

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 @a8671fa0 

no
it make sense
he repeated what he did in the UK 
in the USA
(he had already worked and it worked again)
and he did it in Italy
and it worked here too

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 @fa46ee30 

I just don't find that plausible.  That this one guy who can't even get his own house in order is this master genius capable of manipulating the whole world.

I understand why somebody would WANT to believe that--if the problem is only one single guy, then the solution is to just get rid of only that one single guy.

But life is always way more complicated than that.

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 @a8671fa0 

btw
the problem
are always 'single guys'
capable of convincing or forcing others to commit crimes.

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 @a8671fa0 

the propaganda failed in Ukraine because the Ukrainians 
know the 'system' and know how to recognize it
Furthermore, 
they know what the Russian occupation means...
they have much more experience than the English, Americans and Italians 
about who the Russians really are

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 @fa46ee30 

Gonna have to agree to disagree.  

He can't even control his own country that easily.  He's constantly having to murder people.  If he were this genius, he wouldn't be elevating these people to power in the first place, much less getting his own hands dirty to get rid of them later on.

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 @a8671fa0 

we agree to disagree 👍

btw yes he is losing control... he will not last long now (probably)
too much blod