Lightning is fucking ass. I wasted 25k sats and 2 hours trying to empty my mutiny wallet. Why is it so complicated to make sure I don’t leave any dust behind? Why does a base to lightning swap not have a swap all funds option? I don’t blame them for giving up this shit sucks. How is lightning more expensive than base chain it doesn’t make sense. I’m just going to use WoS again. The total amount of sats I’ve burned trying to self custody lightning is less than the amount I hold on WoS anyway. I’d rather get rugged by WoS than continuously rug myself using lightning lmao. It’s fucking retarded I hope liquid squirts get integrated in nostr soon nostr:npub1jg552aulj07skd6e7y2hu0vl5g8nl5jvfw8jhn6jpjk0vjd0waksvl6n8n nostr:npub1getal6ykt05fsz5nqu4uld09nfj3y3qxmv8crys4aeut53unfvlqr80nfm

I’m really not convinced  that bitcoin p2p is going to work on lightning. Normies aren’t going to deal with this shit they will just use custodial services. And I honestly think that's fine as long as your main stash is in cold storage. Maybe I’m wrong and some devs will find an amazing way to simplify lightning but I’m not holding my breath.


Better hope that block subsidy is worth the energy costs when you remove transaction fees from the network in the pursuit of a more appropriate medium of exchange


Onward 🫡

Onward 🫡


I've got more funds in my Mutiny wallet than my outgoing channel has liquidity. Still trying to figure out how to move my funds out of it.


Yup lightning network is flawed and too fragile for the real world/normies

You basically have to run your own node to have a reliable and stable lightning wallet


Bitcoin needs robust solutions to survive in the real world/be used by normies


Just use alby or wos mahdood


L2 Centralized will always work better


Automation needs to drastically improve the UX of Lightning I think.


Lightning is best while using custodian. Self custodial lightning is hard imo.


I’ll be long gone by then, let Satoshi jr worry about that 😂


Just close the channel lmao base layer maxi >


Even then, you get fucked by force closed channels in a high fee environment


Nah I’m with you bro I’ve never really had confidence in lightning.


Of course! I don’t mind using an inferior solution to avoid getting rugged but it can’t be this bad lmao I lost way more money holding my own keys in lightning


It needs to be braindead easy to use and cheap. Liquid has it right.


Way too fucking hard and expensive


Be like him. https://image.nostr.build/730ba6ffa554b73652de7d3aa72ff4ef14767dcf0290625735d9636c15f7341d.jpg


It’s always about trade offs, everything has it.
This why I use alby and iPhone, also my own node. Don’t put the baby in the basket and throw it out with the bath water. Not sure if that makes sense


Once I learned how you need to balance channels on lightning, I imagined this little toy and said yeahhhh that’s retarded. There aren’t enough sats in the world for everyone to open a lightning channel no matter how small. The idea of opening a lightning channel with your barber, Costco, and Amazon is probably just a fantasy. https://image.nostr.build/e273f812904ead65e4094ffdedbda862a7cebdde84dd5c505e46bfc90e4da653.jpg


This guy is living his best life. He eats glue and stacks sats for NGU using WoS. Meanwhile everyone else is wasting sats trying to hold their own keys😂


💯
The trade off to use custodial lighting is worth it as long as you have your main stash in cold storage


That's about where I'm at. I've been told that someday the base layer fees will be so outrageous that we will have to rely on L2, and then I look at the user experience on lightning and think, jesus, this is a nightmare. Then I rant about lightning and get fed bullshit about tradeoffs - yeah cool, I can choose between someone else rugging me or rugging myself - awesome.


Brain dead easy usually requires custodial service. Even on-chain Bitcoin is used by most people through custodians like Coinbase.


The difference between base and lightning is that at least on the base chain you can choose when to pay a high fee. With lightning, you get force close channels and bad channel management. How lovely would it be to see 100k sats in your lighting wallet but not be able to make a payment because you have no outbound liquidity 🤡


I like the tradeoff that liquid offers. Technically custodial but the rug risk is very small. UX is also great.


That's pretty much where I'm at.


Liquid is great. I just hope they geographically distribute the functionaries enough to minimize the disturbance to the network when the regulatory heat inevitably comes for them.


75 in the federation
Imagine when it’s 500 in every corner of the world


alby is self-custodial now. they're still letting people who have legacy custodial accounts keep them, but i assume they plan to shut it down at some point.


This is the most reasonable thing to predict in the future imo. There might be a way to reduce some of the rug risk by creating a multisig setup similar to the liquid setup. The keys for your lightning wallet could be held by strike, coinkite, and mempool as an example. Unlikely that all of them would collude together to rug you.


As more people adopt it, I think more will join from different parts of the world


They might regret that depending on how they implement it


Liquid is something I still need to look into, I've been gun shy after lightning losses.


I haven’t tried it yet, but it looks pretty awesome from videos I’ve seen. Keeping my legacy custodial accounts until they turn em off though.


Liquid is great. Once I move funds into liquid, I feel no anxiety. I don’t worry about fees or liquidity issues. The only thing is that it’s a little expensive to peg out but it’s totally worth it and still cheaper than lightning.


What are the best wallets for liquid?


Aqua or Green


I’ve only used green wallet but I heard a lot of great things about aqua.


I have them both installed, I'll more then likely go with Green, at least until Aqua is out of beta.


Thank you.


Aqua is for ease of use, let’s say Apple users.
Green is for power users


Once I figured out how to use it, albyhub is working great from desktop, I'm not using their cloud service.


Green also has an option to use tor but it’s super slow and gets stuck a lot.


We're all ears for suggestions!


Read a little on their github last night, would a dumb dumb have issues with the GO stuff?


I'm not very good at technical stuff and not even sure what you are asking. It was a struggle for me to even get it setup.